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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:16 pm
 


MacDonaill MacDonaill:
Joebine mentions that the Northern US and Canada are identical, which is totally untrue and in you want a first example of proof while think of the fact that the majority of US northerners speak with radically different accents than Canadians in any part of the country (think New York, Boston, Buffalo, Detroit etc...) Do you know anyone in Canada who talks like them? Me neither.

The rest of your post was great but I'm a guessing you've never been to Windsor OR Niagara Falls Ont. :lol: Windsor is but a mile from Detroit and NF is pretty darn close to Buffalo.
I grew up in Windsor, and anytime I travelled outside of the Essex/Kent/Lambton county area in Canada, people thought I was an American cuz I spoke with the accent and used some of their idioms. And after being away for 16 years, whenever I go back to the area, I really notice it. So really, if you go to either of those cities, you'll see that the residents have Americanisms in their actions, words, and accents.
I've also found that some people from Southern Manitoba sound a lot like people from Minnesota. And really except for the yankee twang that pops ,a lot of New England coasters sound quite similar to the people from our Maritime provinces.
I also remember watching a show about a trucking company in Maine, or Vermont or something. Initially, I thought it was from Quebec cuz these Americans sure had some French accents going on. Turns out, they were close to Quebec.
These dialectic similarities have nothing to do with nationality and everything to do with regional location. Those of us near the border share a lot more with our American brethren than most people realize.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:22 pm
 


Since 1759, Canadians have had more in common with the US than the UK.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:24 pm
 


You are absolutely right.. many Americans from Vermont inter-married with Québcois(e) and there are some very strong french accents in that area. I have relatives in Bennington Vt. and some in Stanstead Québec. My cousins in Vermont speak better french than I do.. The french who settled in Canada (before the British) have managed to spread their seed in many parts of the US...


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:33 pm
 


BartSimpson BartSimpson:
Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

You don't believe you will? Okay then, let's examine...

What will you do when...


Arky, adding to your points you can add these:

What will Quebec do when the USA requires the CF to move all sensitive military technology out of Quebec? In 1995 the US notified the CF that any CF-18 on the ground in Quebec after secession was subject to destruction by US forces and the CF-18's and other sensitive military tech were, indeed, removed from Quebec during the vote.

What will Quebec do when the US requires them to negotiate their own trade treaties?

What will Quebec do when the US takes Canada's side on the division of northern Quebec? Quebec may be allowed to secede with their southern portion, but the US will not tolerate a Canada that is divided in two by a more or less hostile country. We'll predictably stand by Canada as Canada takes the northern half of Quebec for the new railways and the rerouted Canada Route 1.

What will Quebec do when the US responds to their inevitable courting of anti-American governments by designating Quebec as a controlled country for trade purposes?

And, finally, what will Quebec do when the US and Canada interdict ships from Iran, North Korea, Cuba, and Venezuela heade for Quebec ports?




:lol: :lol: well we all know Jobine will never
answer that one..


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:33 pm
 


kenmore kenmore:
You are absolutely right.. many Americans from Vermont inter-married with Québcois(e) and there are some very strong french accents in that area. I have relatives in Bennington Vt. and some in Stanstead Québec. My cousins in Vermont speak better french than I do.. The french who settled in Canada (before the British) have managed to spread their seed in many parts of the US...


And out west. Let's not forget the Metis.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:36 pm
 


martin14 martin14:
BartSimpson BartSimpson:
Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

You don't believe you will? Okay then, let's examine...

What will you do when...


Arky, adding to your points you can add these:

What will Quebec do when the USA requires the CF to move all sensitive military technology out of Quebec? In 1995 the US notified the CF that any CF-18 on the ground in Quebec after secession was subject to destruction by US forces and the CF-18's and other sensitive military tech were, indeed, removed from Quebec during the vote.

What will Quebec do when the US requires them to negotiate their own trade treaties?

What will Quebec do when the US takes Canada's side on the division of northern Quebec? Quebec may be allowed to secede with their southern portion, but the US will not tolerate a Canada that is divided in two by a more or less hostile country. We'll predictably stand by Canada as Canada takes the northern half of Quebec for the new railways and the rerouted Canada Route 1.

What will Quebec do when the US responds to their inevitable courting of anti-American governments by designating Quebec as a controlled country for trade purposes?

And, finally, what will Quebec do when the US and Canada interdict ships from Iran, North Korea, Cuba, and Venezuela heade for Quebec ports?




:lol: :lol: well we all know Jobine will never
answer that one..


Does that really surprise any of us? :lol:

I mean really, every single time we get a Seperatist on here they never answer the tough questions on the issue. They merely say that they're being oppressed and need to protect their apparently fragile culture(despite it lasting for centuries and continuing to last) and say that the rest of Canada has no culture and is exactly like the United States.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:38 pm
 


There are also many of Aboriginal/Scottish descent. The Hudson's Bay Company was as Scottish it got until very recently. 400 years of buying beaver pelts has left a Scottish imprint in Canada's north, of the DNA kind.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 3:50 pm
 


Joebine Joebine:
well that was not expected, but I'm winning people to my cause !


Its not the people outside of Quebec you have to convince.

Most of us, like alot of people in Quebec are fed up of the whining, the only diference is we can say some of us outaide of Quebec really don't give a shit anymore. But if you do separate on a 50+1% your going to have to deal with the pissed off Quebecers that really do give a shit that have everything to loose, have fun with that mess.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 4:03 pm
 


Arctic_Menace Arctic_Menace:

I mean really, every single time we get a Seperatist on here they never answer the tough questions on the issue. They merely say that they're being oppressed and need to protect their apparently fragile culture(despite it lasting for centuries and continuing to last) and say that the rest of Canada has no culture and is exactly like the United States.


They don't answer because they can't. They're simply not that knowledgeable on the topic so after a couple of direct questions they retreat to empty rhetoric, dodging, waffling and obfuscation, anything to deflect their ignorance.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 5:00 pm
 


As an addendum to my earlier post, since any ships headed for ports in Quebec must transit Canadian or US territorial waters then either country can, of course, interdict Quebec shipping as a matter of sovereignty.

Quebec may well claim sovereign rights, but we can too and we can easily blockade Quebec merely by asserting our own sovereign rights.

Edit: Here's what I figure Quebec (bounded in red) will actually look like after the First Nation land claims are settled/respected and Canada takes the remainder that is not settled or occupied as the Crown land it rightfully is.


Attachments:
File comment: Quebec after partition
map.jpg
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 5:24 pm
 


PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:
MacDonaill MacDonaill:
Joebine mentions that the Northern US and Canada are identical, which is totally untrue and in you want a first example of proof while think of the fact that the majority of US northerners speak with radically different accents than Canadians in any part of the country (think New York, Boston, Buffalo, Detroit etc...) Do you know anyone in Canada who talks like them? Me neither.


These dialectic similarities have nothing to do with nationality and everything to do with regional location. Those of us near the border share a lot more with our American brethren than most people realize.


Despite what you may have noticed, there is significant documentation suggesting the contrary, and not only that, but that the accents on either side of border in the most densely populated regions are actually moving farther apart as time goes by. Like it or not, an international border (as unguarded as it once may have been) does act as a linguistic divide, similarities aside.

If I had to offer my own anecdotal evidence to counter yours, I wouldn't have to think back very far. Trip to Buffalo last year to visit a friend. I live two hours away from him in Ontario, but I was literally shocked by the working-class Buffalo accent and by how different the vowel sounds were from those just over the border, especially the 'A' sound.

Actually, having spent a significant part of my childhood in Upstate NY in the Adirondacks, I remember always knowing when people came from the city (any big city in NY, not just NYC) because they all had very strong accents compared to those of the mountain folks. Their accents had much more diphthongised vowels and were most frequently non-rhotic, meaning they didn't pronounce final R's (like the Brits or the Aussies). You don't find this phenomenon anywhere in Canada. All local accents are strictly rhotic, and vowels are less diphthongised.

All that being said, in the end we do speak the same language and the differences are pallid compared to the similarities. It's only to be expected and it is not a unique situation in the world. Think of Austria and Germany, Francophone Belgium, Switzerland and France, Italophone Switzerland and Italy, Australia and New Zealand and then of course all the Hispanophone countries in Latin America. It doesn't keep them from being different countries and having a distinct culture each one, even though the similarities outweigh the differences in pretty much every case.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:05 pm
 


BartSimpson BartSimpson:
As an addendum to my earlier post, since any ships headed for ports in Quebec must transit Canadian or US territorial waters then either country can, of course, interdict Quebec shipping as a matter of sovereignty.

Quebec may well claim sovereign rights, but we can too and we can easily blockade Quebec merely by asserting our own sovereign rights.

Edit: Here's what I figure Quebec (bounded in red) will actually look like after the First Nation land claims are settled/respected and Canada takes the remainder that is not settled or occupied as the Crown land it rightfully is.


Just to add to your map bart, Gatineau would've stayed a part of Canada and would have West Island Montreal. And some areas in the Gaspe would've rejoined as a part of New Brunswick.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:14 am
 


Sovereignty dream dead: Lucien Bouchard.

So sorry Joebine. :lol:


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 10:30 am
 


DerbyX DerbyX:



:)

I was searching for an English article to post about this matter.

There have always been quarrels inside the Parti Quebecois for as long as the party itself. They are always disputing amongst their ranks, yet there are still separatist partisans that still vote for them anyways. Now, it's time for those nationalists ''sheeple'' in the province to realize that the PQ and the sovereignty issue is irrelevant.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 12:02 pm
 


PimpBrewski123 PimpBrewski123:
DerbyX DerbyX:



:)

I was searching for an English article to post about this matter.

There have always been quarrels inside the Parti Quebecois for as long as the party itself. They are always disputing amongst their ranks, yet there are still separatist partisans that still vote for them anyways. Now, it's time for those nationalists ''sheeple'' in the province to realize that the PQ and the sovereignty issue is irrelevant.


As much as those of us with functioning brains know that, it will still be like talking to a brick wall with regards to the seperatists. :P


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