[Brenda]

bootlegga wrote:

Brenda wrote:

If there would be any. Don't forget that Canada is not one big city. It is a lot of "middle of nowhere".
And we know how every body is bitching that "immigrants should not be allowed to live in the big city when they first come, they should first prove themselves", and that housing prices are awful in the city anyway. No one working in retail or hospitality can afford a place of their own, when they are single working parents.

Why is that seen as "not a big deal"? The first thing we all bitch about is "the lack of service", "the lack of a smile". Duh, if you work for $10, $11/hr, and your rent is $1100, you have 2 kids to feed, would YOU smile? It won't make you get a better job in retail, because the ones above you first have to retire or leave. And somehow, they don't!

Sorry Brenda, but Bart makes a valid point - those with the most skills/experience get the best pay. You might not think it's worthwhile to learn how to do a couple of extra jobs at the Timmies if you worked there, but the ones who know how to bake, run a till and operate the drive thru almost certainly make more than the person who only knows how to operate the till up front or pour coffee.

IF you have an appreciative boss, sure.

Btw, if I would work for a Timmies, I would know the in's and out's of the business and be able to EVERYTHING alone if I had to.
If they would let me. But the way things work here, for as far as I have seen, is: "that is not in your job-description, you should not be doing that". I have a problem with that...

Quote:

It might not be much more, maybe only 25 to 50 cents more per hour, but smart employers reward well-trained staff better than poorly trained staff simply because they can do more and are more productive. If a rush comes at midnight and no one knows how to make donuts, that Timmies is screwed. But if one of the worker has been knows how to fire up some donuts (nowadays it's probably just thaw and microwave), then the store can keep selling donuts all night long until someone more experienced comes in. That makes a big difference on the bottom line.

We keep hearing around 7 pm "sorry, we're out". And that is accepted. The nearest Timmies is an hour's drive away.

Quote:

I say this based on my experience in the service industry (restaurant, fast food, retail, etc). I was always willing to learn how to do new things at my jobs, and as such, I got raises and even the occasional promotion while others who were content to just know the basics didn't.

In the boonies, or in the city?

Quote:

I went from dishwasher at Earl's to assistant kitchen manager in four months (with zero prior cooking experience or training), while others fumed. Why? Because I took it upon myself to constantly keep learning and growing at Earl's, making myself indispensable to management. Same goes for when I worked at Arby's, Eddie Bauer, Flying J, etc. The more you know increases the likelihood that you'll go farther. For example, I have friends who worked so hard at Arby's that they are now franchisees.

Again, in the city or in the boonies?

Quote:

Any manager worth their salt always rewards staff eager to learn new skills or take extra training. I agree that there are terrible managers in the service industry, but if you happen to be employed one, go somewhere else and find someone who values your work ethic and willingness to learn.

If you happen to live in a small town like you do, then of course your options are more limited, but odds are there is someone who would value you and your ability. Low job mobility is unfortunately one of the prices you pay for living in a rural area - just like one of the prices I pay for living in a city is high cost of housing and rush hour traffic.

When there are 123 resume's to 1 $13/hr job, you know you are not indispensable.

[Brenda]

Btw, this is not necessarily about me, or where I live. Canada is just a lot of vast, empty land with tiny towns... Not every one has the luxury to "job-hop", because of the simple fact that there aren't any around.

[bootlegga]

Brenda wrote:

bootlegga wrote:

Brenda wrote:

If there would be any. Don't forget that Canada is not one big city. It is a lot of "middle of nowhere".
And we know how every body is bitching that "immigrants should not be allowed to live in the big city when they first come, they should first prove themselves", and that housing prices are awful in the city anyway. No one working in retail or hospitality can afford a place of their own, when they are single working parents.

Why is that seen as "not a big deal"? The first thing we all bitch about is "the lack of service", "the lack of a smile". Duh, if you work for $10, $11/hr, and your rent is $1100, you have 2 kids to feed, would YOU smile? It won't make you get a better job in retail, because the ones above you first have to retire or leave. And somehow, they don't!

Sorry Brenda, but Bart makes a valid point - those with the most skills/experience get the best pay. You might not think it's worthwhile to learn how to do a couple of extra jobs at the Timmies if you worked there, but the ones who know how to bake, run a till and operate the drive thru almost certainly make more than the person who only knows how to operate the till up front or pour coffee.

IF you have an appreciative boss, sure.

Btw, if I would work for a Timmies, I would know the in's and out's of the business and be able to EVERYTHING alone if I had to.
If they would let me. But the way things work here, for as far as I have seen, is: "that is not in your job-description, you should not be doing that". I have a problem with that...

Unless you work at a unionized operation, you almost never hear that.

Employers (smart ones anyways) always want their staff as heavily cross-trained as possible. That way if someone is sick or is on vacation, the company doesn't grind to a halt.

Brenda wrote:

Quote:

It might not be much more, maybe only 25 to 50 cents more per hour, but smart employers reward well-trained staff better than poorly trained staff simply because they can do more and are more productive. If a rush comes at midnight and no one knows how to make donuts, that Timmies is screwed. But if one of the worker has been knows how to fire up some donuts (nowadays it's probably just thaw and microwave), then the store can keep selling donuts all night long until someone more experienced comes in. That makes a big difference on the bottom line.

We keep hearing around 7 pm "sorry, we're out". And that is accepted. The nearest Timmies is an hour's drive away.

The reason you hear that is because either A) there are not enough trained employees, B) the employer is too cheap to cross-train and give people small raises. My bet would be on the lack of employees and not a cheap boss.

Timmies was just an example. I'm sure there are other restaurants and retail shops in your town/area. The point still holds no matter which company you work for.

Brenda wrote:

Quote:

I say this based on my experience in the service industry (restaurant, fast food, retail, etc). I was always willing to learn how to do new things at my jobs, and as such, I got raises and even the occasional promotion while others who were content to just know the basics didn't.

In the boonies, or in the city?

Quote:

I went from dishwasher at Earl's to assistant kitchen manager in four months (with zero prior cooking experience or training), while others fumed. Why? Because I took it upon myself to constantly keep learning and growing at Earl's, making myself indispensable to management. Same goes for when I worked at Arby's, Eddie Bauer, Flying J, etc. The more you know increases the likelihood that you'll go farther. For example, I have friends who worked so hard at Arby's that they are now franchisees.

Again, in the city or in the boonies?

It's irrelevant to a good employer.

Brenda wrote:

Quote:

Any manager worth their salt always rewards staff eager to learn new skills or take extra training. I agree that there are terrible managers in the service industry, but if you happen to be employed one, go somewhere else and find someone who values your work ethic and willingness to learn.

If you happen to live in a small town like you do, then of course your options are more limited, but odds are there is someone who would value you and your ability. Low job mobility is unfortunately one of the prices you pay for living in a rural area - just like one of the prices I pay for living in a city is high cost of housing and rush hour traffic.

When there are 123 resume's to 1 $13/hr job, you know you are not indispensable.

Sure you can - if you bring way more to the table than 122 of those other people.

My POV is that a person needs to make themselves as capable as two people and then they'll never lack job security - after all, who would fire you if they knew they had to hire two people to replace you?

Brenda wrote:

Canada is just a lot of vast, empty land with tiny towns... Not every one has the luxury to "job-hop", because of the simple fact that there aren't any around.

No, that's true, and I understand your frustration. And hile I don't mean to belittle your situation, it is one that less than 20% of Canadians deal with (more than 80% of Canadians live in urban areas according to the 2006 census).

However, you choose to live in out in the boonies, so IMHO you really don't a reasonable argument here.

Same goes with me and complaining about traffic or the high cost of housing.

It's a fact of life based on where you choose to live. If you don't like the job situation where you live, move - it's a free country.

[Brenda]

Yet, everybody is bitching about housing prices and traffic, not to mention gas prices

Yes, it's a free country. But that doesn't mean we don't have responsibilities. Just packing up and leaving is not always possible.

[PostFactum]

Canada, hey you west there
I see you on my TV and I smell you in my air.
And sometimes I think you might be calling me.
From across the ocean I hear those hockey plays
I've got a picture of the Lake Louise
I've got visa papers taped to my fridge.
Sometimes you make me so fucking scared.
Now the guy at the border says where's your work permit and 10 000 CAD
And I make eyes like this

[cougar]

Andy, what you call "myths" are actually lies that Canada prefers to support.

Someone along the line knows the benefits of immigration. Those benefits are not benefits to all Canadians or Canada as a country; they are benefits to just a few people (we can call them traitors).

This is why the lies continue and immigrants still come in big numbers.

[cougar]

Brenda wrote:

Yes, it's a free country. But that doesn't mean we don't have responsibilities. Just packing up and leaving is not always possible.

No, it is not a free country. If you are forced to work 50 hours/week and are still unable to even pay your bills, this is not freedom, this is slavery.

[Bruce_the_vii]

I sort of see the reason for high immigration is the love affair people have with it which gives the okay to the Minister to keep the level high. People are pro-immigration, will say things like immigration improves Canada socially, economically and culturally although such statements have scant meaning to the people polled. Get the numbers right, it's quiet something to hand out a Canadian level of living to a third worlder but there's a limit to the numbers it'll work on.

[herbie]

The only gripe I ever have about immigration is that none of them end up where they're "needed". We let in a quarter million and three end up in Prince George. Meanwhile the local talent pool puts as little effort as possible into their jobs or education, biding time until the mill or the mine calls.

[Gunnair]

cougar wrote:

Brenda wrote:

Yes, it's a free country. But that doesn't mean we don't have responsibilities. Just packing up and leaving is not always possible.

No, it is not a free country. If you are forced to work 50 hours/week and are still unable to even pay your bills, this is not freedom, this is slavery.

Get a better job.

[Brenda]

Gunnair wrote:

cougar wrote:

Brenda wrote:

Yes, it's a free country. But that doesn't mean we don't have responsibilities. Just packing up and leaving is not always possible.

No, it is not a free country. If you are forced to work 50 hours/week and are still unable to even pay your bills, this is not freedom, this is slavery.

Get a better job.

Or cut your expenses.

[Gunnair]

Brenda wrote:

Gunnair wrote:

cougar wrote:

No, it is not a free country. If you are forced to work 50 hours/week and are still unable to even pay your bills, this is not freedom, this is slavery.

Get a better job.

Or cut your expenses.

Yup. Complaining about not being able to buy a Mazda, 50 in flat screen tv and an Iphone with a big plan while working at Mcdonalds.

[andyt]

All very nice moralizing. But, "if we stop shopping the terrorists have won." Or more recently "if we stop shopping our economy will collapse." Our economy has been based on every increasing consumption. Meanwhile wages for the middle class held steady, while middle class jobs were shipped to China. People thought they had it made because of the housing bubble, cheap credit, and cheap crap from China. All the govts are still trying to figure out how to restart that whole system, because if not we're all supposedly fucked. And especially the Chinese, because they rely on their high growth rate to mask all the social problems they're sitting on. The only ones who did really well are the 1 percenters, pushing all that hot money into the economy instead of re-investing in business.