[Thanos]

BartSimpson wrote:

Thanos wrote:

Can't stay there forever so this is the right thing to do.

That country has been a meat grinder for 3,000 years and the people there are a collective pain in the *** to everyone in the region.

The "right thing to do" then is to expel them all from their lands the same way the Romans did with the pesky Jews in Israel after the 70AD revolt.

Nah. The Liberals and Dippers would just start agitating to let them all immigrate here.

[EyeBrock]

They have to make a graceful exit andy. The politics of war.

[Thanos]

andyt wrote:

Thanos wrote:

Can't stay there forever so this is the right thing to do.

Except they should then leave en masse. This way they could take more casualties as their strength is reduced.

The same prediction of doom didn't come true when the same withdrawal plan was begun in Iraq. Or even in Vietnam for that matter. I think it's long past time that we quit looking at idiots like the Taliban as anything more than a small-time regional annoyance. The whole purpose of going to A-stan was to wipe out Al Qaeda, and this had practically been accomplished, and other Al Qaeda affiliates in places like Yemen and Somalia are subject to regular harassment both from the local governments and from the forces of the US. Obviously eternal vigiliance, police & intelligence interdiction, and precision military attacks are required on an ongoing-basis to deal with this, but whole-sale occupation combined with nation-building is a complete waste of time, money, and lives.

Leaving the area for the most part might also have the beneficial effect of mollifying and somewhat stabilizing Pakistan, and those guys are far more of a potential threat than the Taliban could ever hope to be.

[andyt]

Thanos wrote:

andyt wrote:

Thanos wrote:

Can't stay there forever so this is the right thing to do.

Except they should then leave en masse. This way they could take more casualties as their strength is reduced.

The same prediction of doom didn't come true when the same withdrawal plan was begun in Iraq. Or even in Vietnam for that matter. I think it's long past time that we quit looking at idiots like the Taliban as anything more than a small-time regional annoyance. The whole purpose of going to A-stan was to wipe out Al Qaeda, and this had practically been accomplished, and other Al Qaeda affiliates in places like Yemen and Somalia are subject to regular harassment both from the local governments and from the forces of the US. Obviously eternal vigiliance, police & intelligence interdiction, and precision military attacks are required on an ongoing-basis to deal with this, but whole-sale occupation combined with nation-building is a complete waste of time, money, and lives.

Leaving the area for the most part might also have the beneficial effect of mollifying and somewhat stabilizing Pakistan, and those guys are far more of a potential threat than the Taliban could ever hope to be.

But Astan is not pacified the way Iraq was. US commanders are saying that this draw down would seriously affect their fighting capability during fighting season. If the remaining troops retrench behind the wire, ie just hold the fort, that would be different. To embarrassing to have the Talibs rampaging in the countryside while the troops hide at base, I guess.

Why still leave 70,000 troops behind? It's obviously the end, so just get out.

[Thanos]

It's to temporarily hold the Taliban at bay so the Afghans themselves can take over the process. If the non-Taliban Afghans don't step up to the plate themselves and take over their own war effort the Allies still have to leave anyway. There's only two choices here. Either stay in A-stan forever or don't stay in A-stan forever. The scale of the country is massive to the point of requiring almost a million soldiers and a twenty-year occupation to pacify it completely, and that is simply an impossibility on both counts.

[andyt]

Thanos wrote:

It's to temporarily hold the Taliban at bay so the Afghans themselves can take over the process. If the non-Taliban Afghans don't step up to the plate themselves and take over their own war effort the Allies still have to leave anyway. There's only two choices here. Either stay in A-stan forever or don't stay in A-stan forever. The scale of the country is massive to the point of requiring almost a million soldiers and a twenty-year occupation to pacify it completely, and that is simply an impossibility on both counts.

I fully agree. But what I read is commanders complaining because they were still taking the fight to the Taliban and would be undermanned. That's no good. It's one thing to hold the fort for an orderly departure, another to go out and look for trouble. If the still want to do the latter they should make sure they have sufficient strength. Personally I think it's a lost cause.

But then the argument from some people on this forum will likely be, as it has been, that it's better to stay in Astan to fight them over here than come home and fight them at home.

[Zipperfish]

AS long as they aren't airlifting me off the fricking embassy roof as the Taliban rolls in!

[Thanos]

You should be safe as long as they don't find 20 kilos of hash or heroin taped to your colon when you're leaving. After that it'll make your time as a towel-boy in a Turkish prison look like fun by comparison.