[Bruce_the_vii]

We have a national policy of official multi-culturalism. And we let in people from around the world, some 160 different countries are represented in Toronto. Personally I can't see the rhyme and reason to it. I don't think it's the problem but is it working. For example wouldn't it make more sense to have special movements from one country so we build a larger community here. This is exactly what they did in the 1950s and 1960s with Italian immigrants to Toronto. In Toronto there are Italian stores, community centres and even nursing homes. If you are brought up Italian in Toronto there's a community and you have the prospect of meeting a nice Italian girl. The other 160 are just assimilating. Anyone have any insight or comment on how the ethnic communities in Canada are working?

[Goober_McGee]

I'm not sure how to answer this without sounding like a complete racist, which I'm not, I'm also not really sure what it is you're asking, but in my opinion those people in Toronto who represent 160 countries aren't really assimilating and their communities as a whole aren't either. To many immigrants, Canada is just a place to live, it's not their home country and it's more specifically not viewed as their current country. Don't get me wrong there are many who strive to be contributing members of the larger Canadian society which is fantastic, and keeping culture and language is important, but adopting the Canadian lifestyle and Canadian values (which are Western values) should be paramount when coming to this country. Yes you have freedom of religion and freedom to speak whatever language you want but those freedoms are secondary to assimilating within the host country's society. I think that was the original aim of the multiculturalism act, you can be whatever you want to be but you're Canadian first. Unfortunately it hasn't turned out that way for many immigrants from non-Western countries, who are beginning to ghettoize themselves, or already live in enclaves. Maybe these are just the beginnings of new neighbourhoods/communities like Little Italy, who knows, but Canadians of Italian descent are just that, Canadian first Italian second. At least thats the impression that I get.

/end of 4am rant, I hope it makes some sense.
If there are any spelling or grammatical errors, sorry.

[OldChum]

It makes sense to me and is how I feel too. The earlier immigrants to this land also stayed out of trouble .

[Bruce_the_vii]

I'm just asking for comments about ethnic communities. An opinion or some information about how they are working.

I think the idea of multiculturalism is that immigrants bring their culture with them rather than assimilate but keep their religion as you opin. However at root I think multiculturalism is a slick poliitcal phrase and not to be taken literally. That is we aren't really going to have 160 ethnic communities in Toronto, they are going to assimilate.

[Gunnair]

It's an interesting fact that as a Celt (born in Canada), I wear a kilt all of the time and I'm often comolimented on it whereas an Indian wearing a sari simply does not want to assimilate. Natives are often chastized that they should live their more traditional lifestyles and thrown off the trappings of the west when we discuss traditional hunts and such. Sadly, it seems that societies complaints about the lack of assimilation seem to have an underlayer of simple racism. That being said, it's also no surprise because we want people who come here to adapt to us, not the other way around, and that has also not been happening. We have yet to find that balance that says it's okay to wear your sari, or turban, or pakol, or chapan as long as you don't mind putting up XMas lights, playing hockey, or drinking a Timmies and eating some poutine. I think if that happened, we might have a bit more balanced society where we can learn and appreciate each other. Ultimately, it's a two way street. The immigrants have to adapt to our customs, and we have to accept some of theirs. That's how we've gotten where we are now with our German XMas trees, Native lacross, Christian Easter, Irish St. Paddys day, Quebecois poutine, and Chinese New Year.

[EyeBrock]

You wear a kilt all the time?

[Gunnair]

EyeBrock wrote:

You wear a kilt all the time?

Yes.

[Bruce_the_vii]

I get tired at the characterization of Canadians as "racist". The working class, some workies, are pretty plain culturally and will call Hindus in turbans "ragheads" and that but this is not serious. In fact they'll get along. There's some mild racism around, one encounters it. I don't expect Canadians to take an interest in the 160 ethnic classes the government has let in either. I just don't expect then to get excited about being "sensative" to all these different cultures.

[kenmore]

Multiculturalism is not working.. should be scrapped. The problem with immigration started with the influx from the middle east and third world. People from those parts of the world have nothing in common with North Americans or Western Europeans. They do not want to integrate and its a one way deal of taking what they can get. European immigrants came here,worked hard and contributed to the country. They shared religous values and intigrated well. There have been (possible) terrorist acts in Montréal and I suspect the burning of churches in the Toronto area and Québec are not isolated incidents. I cannot understand the gates being opened for immigrants from the middle east after 9/11. I don't consider myself racist. Perhaps I am, but I am seeing the effect of the muslim invasion in Québec. I read an article in the Toronto Star about the convention held in Toronto with 17000 muslims in attendance. I found it interesting that the muslim cleric advocated peace to muslims and muslims not killing each other.. no mention of not killing anyone else... go figure..

[CommanderSock]

Immigrants work. A common misconception is that immigrants come here and freeload. Not true.

I'll abstain from commenting on Muslims. At my work there are west Africans, Latin Americans and Asians. All professionals and most of them obtained their post graduate education in Canada. Many completely re-did everything here.

They work hard, their children are now overrepresented in universities (which is a good thing), and they won't settle for a basic education realizing the potential of holding a higher degree.

[Bruce_the_vii]

The Canadian immigration program has always been oriented to skills and professionals and 2002 it was skewed to people with university degrees. What we get here in Canada is the middle classes from poor countries who are, hey, middle class in culture.

[CommanderSock]

Bruce_the_vii wrote:

The Canadian immigration program has always been oriented to skills and professionals and 2002 it was skewed to people with university degrees. What we get here in Canada is the middle classes from poor countries who are, hey, middle class in culture.

That's not a bad thing at all.

[kenmore]

CommanderSock wrote:

Immigrants work. A common misconception is that immigrants come here and freeload. Not true.

I'll abstain from commenting on Muslims. At my work there are west Africans, Latin Americans and Asians. All professionals and most of them obtained their post graduate education in Canada. Many completely re-did everything here.

They work hard, their children are now overrepresented in universities (which is a good thing), and they won't settle for a basic education realizing the potential of holding a higher degree.

For the most part yes.. immigrants work.. but there are many who dont.. including elderly family members and shit loads of single mothers who are brought here and dumped with their kids. muslims are allowed more than one wife.. the first one counts as the legal and the rest.. in some cases 4 or 5 are classified as unwed single mothers and are on the dole.. and they (muslims) don't mind telling you.. I have a few family members who work immigration and they can tell you the stats.. Canada is being gouged and screwed and don't think it isn't.. and alot of money earned here goes out of the country. You might want to do some statistical research.. you might be surprised. .. I actually wrote the Mcguinty government when I heard a muslim on TV talking about his 5 wives and how they got government assistance and that is when I got the info about how it works...

[EyeBrock]

I'm doing fine thanks. And I was solidly working-class and under educated in my home country. I upgraded in Canada.

This is a very silly thread.

[Gunnair]

Bruce_the_vii wrote:

I get tired at the characterization of Canadians as "racist". The working class, some workies, are pretty plain culturally and will call Hindus in turbans "ragheads" and that but this is not serious. In fact they'll get along. There's some mild racism around, one encounters it. I don't expect Canadians to take an interest in the 160 ethnic classes the government has let in either. I just don't expect then to get excited about being "sensative" to all these different cultures.

If by sensitive you mean not calling Sikhs `ragheads`or Persians `sand niggers` or the Irish `bogtrotters`then I guess you have a different definition of sensitivity. Kinda like not walking around and addressing fat people `fattie`or bald people `baldy`or women `split`... and so on.