[Newsbot]

Title: Edmonton teacher who gave 0s for unsubmitted work fired
Category: Misc CDN
Posted By: Strutz
Date: 2012-09-14 20:30:27
Canadian

[bootlegga]

IF he failed to mark exams, how is that any different from his kids not doing assignments? Shouldn't he have been given a "chance" to re-do the work?

[Lemmy]

bootlegga bootlegga:

IF he failed to mark exams, how is that any different from his kids not doing assignments? Shouldn't he have been given a "chance" to re-do the work?

SNAP!

[martin14]

Hope he can find a job somewhere else, we shouldn't lose teachers like him.

[PublicAnimalNo9]

It's a goddam sad day in Canada when a teacher gets fired for doing his job!
Boy oh boy, Mr.Shitt is going to get an e-mail he is NOT going to like reading. I've got his apology right fucking here

[martin14]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

It's a goddam sad day in Canada when a teacher gets fired for doing his job!
Boy oh boy, Mr.Shitt is going to get an e-mail he is NOT going to like reading. I've got his apology right fucking here

Well, post it here with the addy so we can all send it.

[PJB]

Simply a reaction to the 'my kid is perfect no matter what he does or doesn't do' scenario. I really feel sorry for kids in school nowadays. The aren't cool unless they have the newest of the new of everything and they graduate with the expectation of instant wealth and power. Who blew all of this purple smoke up their asses....We did!

[hurley_108]

I've been reading a lot about this case, as it's topical given that my wife is studying to be a teacher, topical in that he was a physics teacher and I'm a physics grad of the U of A, and just a generally thought provoking case.

My wife has heard all about the supposed benefits of no-zero policies. The rationale that teachers should grade based on knowledge gained, not behaviour. To a limited extent I can get behind it, as long as there ultimately are consequences for failure to complete work. Bans from participation in extra-curricular activities, for example. I read that students of Mr. Dorval's supported him in being assigned zeroes for incomplete work but thinking back, I'd much rather have been given a zero than an order to report to the principal / vice principal for missing homework.

But what's more interesting to me is the almost complete inability of anyone to separate the policy from the man. Whether you're in support of or opposed to the no zero policy, Mr. Dorval conducted himself in a wholly inappropriate manner. Witholding unmarked unit exams from a Physics 30 class until less than two weeks from the diploma is utterly unacceptable. Leaving a Physics 20 class with a unit unstarted is wholly unacceptable. These are not facts in dispute. These are facts in evidence as proven by Mr. Dorval's failure to refute them at his termination hearing, as stated in his letter of termination which is available to onyone who cares to read it.

If Mr. Dorval truly cared about his students, he should have made his point this summer, not months before, mid-year, putting himself in the position of being suspended mid-year, with that being an easily forseeable consequence, thus disrupting the education of all his students.

Mr. Dorval, in short, is the sort of self-important, in-it-for-himself teacher his supporters would on any other day rage against were it not for him wrapping himself up in this "heroes give zeroes" banner.

His termination was the result of nothing but his own actions. He is no whistle blower. Honest, principled whistle-blowers don't mug for cameras with a bright red zero marked on a notepad, while suspended and collecting full salary. He is no hero. Heroes don't willfully punish those they purport to be fighting for. Heroes do their job.

[martin14]

hurley_108 hurley_108:

he should have made his point this summer, not months before, mid-year,

No one would have cared in the summer.

If you have any doubts, ask yourself how many times the teacher's unions
go on strike in the summer.

Answer: Never, September only.

[bootlegga]

I couldn't find his email address, although even if I did, he no doubt has an assistant who screens it anyways, but here is the contact info for Edmonton Pblci School Boards;

Superintendent of Schools
Edgar Schmidt

Centre for Education
One Kingsway
Edmonton, Alberta
T5H 4G9

T. 780.429.8000
F. 780.429.8318
E. [email protected]

[EyeBrock]

hurley_108 hurley_108:

I've been reading a lot about this case, as it's topical given that my wife is studying to be a teacher, topical in that he was a physics teacher and I'm a physics grad of the U of A, and just a generally thought provoking case.

My wife has heard all about the supposed benefits of no-zero policies. The rationale that teachers should grade based on knowledge gained, not behaviour. To a limited extent I can get behind it, as long as there ultimately are consequences for failure to complete work. Bans from participation in extra-curricular activities, for example. I read that students of Mr. Dorval's supported him in being assigned zeroes for incomplete work but thinking back, I'd much rather have been given a zero than an order to report to the principal / vice principal for missing homework.

But what's more interesting to me is the almost complete inability of anyone to separate the policy from the man. Whether you're in support of or opposed to the no zero policy, Mr. Dorval conducted himself in a wholly inappropriate manner. Witholding unmarked unit exams from a Physics 30 class until less than two weeks from the diploma is utterly unacceptable. Leaving a Physics 20 class with a unit unstarted is wholly unacceptable. These are not facts in dispute. These are facts in evidence as proven by Mr. Dorval's failure to refute them at his termination hearing, as stated in his letter of termination which is available to onyone who cares to read it.

If Mr. Dorval truly cared about his students, he should have made his point this summer, not months before, mid-year, putting himself in the position of being suspended mid-year, with that being an easily forseeable consequence, thus disrupting the education of all his students.

Mr. Dorval, in short, is the sort of self-important, in-it-for-himself teacher his supporters would on any other day rage against were it not for him wrapping himself up in this "heroes give zeroes" banner.

His termination was the result of nothing but his own actions. He is no whistle blower. Honest, principled whistle-blowers don't mug for cameras with a bright red zero marked on a notepad, while suspended and collecting full salary. He is no hero. Heroes don't willfully punish those they purport to be fighting for. Heroes do their job.

I'm with you on this and good to see you back!

[Gunnair]

hurley_108 hurley_108:

I've been reading a lot about this case, as it's topical given that my wife is studying to be a teacher, topical in that he was a physics teacher and I'm a physics grad of the U of A, and just a generally thought provoking case.

My wife has heard all about the supposed benefits of no-zero policies. The rationale that teachers should grade based on knowledge gained, not behaviour. To a limited extent I can get behind it, as long as there ultimately are consequences for failure to complete work. Bans from participation in extra-curricular activities, for example. I read that students of Mr. Dorval's supported him in being assigned zeroes for incomplete work but thinking back, I'd much rather have been given a zero than an order to report to the principal / vice principal for missing homework.

But what's more interesting to me is the almost complete inability of anyone to separate the policy from the man. Whether you're in support of or opposed to the no zero policy, Mr. Dorval conducted himself in a wholly inappropriate manner. Witholding unmarked unit exams from a Physics 30 class until less than two weeks from the diploma is utterly unacceptable. Leaving a Physics 20 class with a unit unstarted is wholly unacceptable. These are not facts in dispute. These are facts in evidence as proven by Mr. Dorval's failure to refute them at his termination hearing, as stated in his letter of termination which is available to onyone who cares to read it.

If Mr. Dorval truly cared about his students, he should have made his point this summer, not months before, mid-year, putting himself in the position of being suspended mid-year, with that being an easily forseeable consequence, thus disrupting the education of all his students.

Mr. Dorval, in short, is the sort of self-important, in-it-for-himself teacher his supporters would on any other day rage against were it not for him wrapping himself up in this "heroes give zeroes" banner.

His termination was the result of nothing but his own actions. He is no whistle blower. Honest, principled whistle-blowers don't mug for cameras with a bright red zero marked on a notepad, while suspended and collecting full salary. He is no hero. Heroes don't willfully punish those they purport to be fighting for. Heroes do their job.

Agreed. Even though I agree with his stance, his tactics are beginning to appear questionable these days. Like EB said, good to see you back. Been missing that voice of reason of yours around here.

[hurley_108]

Ha ha! I don't know if I'm back. This case just got me so annoyed that I needed to vent, so I checked if there was a thread here on it, and sure enough there was!

The reception is warm enough, though. I might pop in from time to time.

[raydan]

hurley_108 hurley_108:

My wife has heard all about the supposed benefits of no-zero policies. The rationale that teachers should grade based on knowledge gained, not behaviour.

When I think of teachers, part of their job is and will always be, dispensers of knowledge. But I see it as a very small part because, let's face it, you don't need teachers (especially in the computer age) to get knowledge. I think the most important job for teachers is to get kids interested in learning, to stimulate their curiosity and creativity. Another part of teaching is to instill good work ethics and essentially, prepare them for college and the work force... because let's face it, do you really want an employee who can never get his work done on time.

All this to say that I don't completely agree with the policy.

[bootlegga]

hurley_108 hurley_108:

I've been reading a lot about this case, as it's topical given that my wife is studying to be a teacher, topical in that he was a physics teacher and I'm a physics grad of the U of A, and just a generally thought provoking case.

My wife has heard all about the supposed benefits of no-zero policies. The rationale that teachers should grade based on knowledge gained, not behaviour. To a limited extent I can get behind it, as long as there ultimately are consequences for failure to complete work. Bans from participation in extra-curricular activities, for example. I read that students of Mr. Dorval's supported him in being assigned zeroes for incomplete work but thinking back, I'd much rather have been given a zero than an order to report to the principal / vice principal for missing homework.

But what's more interesting to me is the almost complete inability of anyone to separate the policy from the man. Whether you're in support of or opposed to the no zero policy, Mr. Dorval conducted himself in a wholly inappropriate manner. Witholding unmarked unit exams from a Physics 30 class until less than two weeks from the diploma is utterly unacceptable. Leaving a Physics 20 class with a unit unstarted is wholly unacceptable. These are not facts in dispute. These are facts in evidence as proven by Mr. Dorval's failure to refute them at his termination hearing, as stated in his letter of termination which is available to onyone who cares to read it.

If Mr. Dorval truly cared about his students, he should have made his point this summer, not months before, mid-year, putting himself in the position of being suspended mid-year, with that being an easily forseeable consequence, thus disrupting the education of all his students.

Mr. Dorval, in short, is the sort of self-important, in-it-for-himself teacher his supporters would on any other day rage against were it not for him wrapping himself up in this "heroes give zeroes" banner.

His termination was the result of nothing but his own actions. He is no whistle blower. Honest, principled whistle-blowers don't mug for cameras with a bright red zero marked on a notepad, while suspended and collecting full salary. He is no hero. Heroes don't willfully punish those they purport to be fighting for. Heroes do their job.

I understand the rationale for the no-zeroes policy, marginal/poor students who would likely turn in nothing at all and head for a life of crime/poverty instead might actually choose to learn something. In theory, that sounds great. The problem is that it is applied to all students, and allows some students to skate by without putting in much effort if they don't feel like it.

In the real world, if I don't feel like doing my job, pretty soon I'm out of a job. Same goes for university - put in zero effort and you'll get a zero, no ifs and/or buts.

Frankly, the reasons you (and the school board) point out are nothing more than nitpicking. I agree Dorval did a bit a grandstanding and didn't do properly complete the course load, but after he was suspended, what was he supposed to do, teach his kids from home or over the internet?

Sorry, but in this case, the school board just wanted to pile as much crap as possible into his termination to fight off all the terrible publicity they have received over this policy.

Still, good to see you back. We'll have to get together for poker again!