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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:19 pm
 


Title: 'European discovery of Americas' school worksheet angers Saskatoon mom
Category: Misc CDN
Posted By: N_Fiddledog
Date: 2019-09-13 12:38:46
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:19 pm
 


I would question who's really trying to encourage a rewriting of history here: the SasKatoon school system or the CBC?

The CBC wants to make it a story that there's something wrong about claiming there was a European discovery. You might want to make an issue of whether it was Columbus or the Vikings but there's nothing false about the idea Europeans did eventually discover the Americas were there. Then the world's history changed. It was important as a fact. The right or wrong of it is a separate discussion.

It is true that native populations of lesser strength were moved aside just as has happened throughout the world and throughout history but it is absolutely correct that Europeans at one time or another did discover the existence of the Americas.

Colonization, if the CBC wants to push for its inclusion on the question sheet would be a separate question. It does not erase a fact, it only recognizes the existence of another one.


Last edited by N_Fiddledog on Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:22 pm
 


It was the 10th Century when Lief Eriksson discovered the Americas. Not the 15th. Columbus was second place. Kid gets an "F". Mom also gets an "F".

The fact that you disagree with the question, does not negate it's validity. Europeans, be it Viking, Brendan Monks or Portuguese Explorers discovered North America. Does it minimize the atrocities committed by the early settlers? no, its a mere statement of fact. Europeans discovered the Americas.

Admitting that doesn't mean anything other than, Europeans discovered this series of continents.


Last edited by llama66 on Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:23 pm
 


N_Fiddledog wrote:
You might want to make an issue of whether it was Columbus or the Vikings but there's nothing false about the idea Europeans did eventually discover the Americas were there.


But if one wants to get bogged down in technicalities were natives the first to discover the Americas or was it the Chinese.

I think I've heard Muslims claim it was them. :roll:


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:32 pm
 


Valid point, but I thought Zheng He's arrival was early 15th century, about 70 years before Columbus.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:00 pm
 


Zhen? You got me there. [huh] I don't know that one. I was thinking the land bridge theory but when I look into it, it might be wrong to connect the proposed land bridge people by heritage to China.

https://theconversation.com/first-ameri ... ests-23747


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:49 pm
 


llama66 wrote:
Valid point, but I thought Zheng He's arrival was early 15th century, about 70 years before Columbus.


Yup and this goes alongway to explaining why half the native tribes on the West Coast of North America and half the Penguin's in Antarctica look much more oriental than given their ancestry should.

The Treasure ships had a rule that if one of the ships was wrecked or crew members went missing they were left behind which goes along way to explaining why they're still finding 15th Century Chinese artifacts all over what was then the unknown world.

The Book "When China Ruled the Seas" goes along way in explaining this claim.

So technically this woman is right, Europeans didn't "discover" North America, the Chinese beat them to it but, they never ventured anywhere but the coastal areas of the places they found. When you think about it though, she's also wrong because it could be technically said that the current group of Natives who claim North America as the First Nations were actually the ones who discovered North America when they crossed the land bridge from Asia and displaced the few residents who were living here originally.

But then again, they'd all be wrong because there were people living here before any of these other usurpers to the crown showed up. So it's really the people who came out of Eurasia and weren't the current First Nations who discovered North America and all the whining and complaining about it doesn't change that fact.

Quote:
This long standstill therefore meant that the people who arrived in the Americas – when the ice finally retreated and allowed entry – were genetically different to the individuals who had left Siberia thousands of years earlier. "Arguably one of the most important parts of the process is what happened in Beringia. That's when they differentiated from Asians and started becoming Native Americans," says Connie Mulligan of the University of Florida in Gainesville, US, who took part in this early analysis.

http://www.bbc.com/earth/story/20170328 ... e-americas


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:38 pm
 


White people are the devil, part twenty-million, as per modern activist standards.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 6:58 am
 


Why can't we just abolish the treaties? Abolish reservations and the Indian Act. No more free rides. This is Canada to bad either be Canadian or be your own country and go back to living in teepies. You're Canadian or you are not. Screw these self entitled racists.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:32 am
 


Dragontail69 wrote:
Why can't we just abolish the treaties? Abolish reservations and the Indian Act. No more free rides. This is Canada to bad either be Canadian or be your own country and go back to living in teepies. You're Canadian or you are not. Screw these self entitled racists.


Because the Treaties are part of the Constitution and actually establish our (non-Natives) right to live here. They've been repeatedly confirmed by the courts. Maybe if we hadn't constantly broken the promises we made in the Treaties the Natives wouldn't have the problems they do now. The reserves are all they've got left of the living spaces they were originally promised.

And those "free rides" you talk about are often much more urban legends than actual facts. Native people living in cities (now the majority) pay taxes just like you and me. So do Natives who live on the rez but come into town to buy things like groceries, or who stop to get gas on their way home.

There are plenty of Natives out there who are proud to be Canadian or otherwise don't mind having us as neighbours. Maybe if the rest of us laid off on the racist bullshit they have to deal with, actually listened to their suggestions on how to improve things, actually funded their communities on par with non-Native communities, and so forth, there might not be as much of a problem.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 12:19 pm
 


JaredMilne wrote:
Dragontail69 wrote:
Why can't we just abolish the treaties? Abolish reservations and the Indian Act. No more free rides. This is Canada to bad either be Canadian or be your own country and go back to living in teepies. You're Canadian or you are not. Screw these self entitled racists.


Because the Treaties are part of the Constitution and actually establish our (non-Natives) right to live here. They've been repeatedly confirmed by the courts. Maybe if we hadn't constantly broken the promises we made in the Treaties the Natives wouldn't have the problems they do now. The reserves are all they've got left of the living spaces they were originally promised.

And those "free rides" you talk about are often much more urban legends than actual facts. Native people living in cities (now the majority) pay taxes just like you and me. So do Natives who live on the rez but come into town to buy things like groceries, or who stop to get gas on their way home.

There are plenty of Natives out there who are proud to be Canadian or otherwise don't mind having us as neighbours. Maybe if the rest of us laid off on the racist bullshit they have to deal with, actually listened to their suggestions on how to improve things, actually funded their communities on par with non-Native communities, and so forth, there might not be as much of a problem.

R=UP


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 1:36 pm
 


I guess all this fuss is about what the word “discovered” means. The Europeans discovered the Americas for themselves, not for all humankind. When children learn new information in school we say they “discovered” it, we only mean it’s new information to them, not to the rest of ys. For this same reason it’s not wrong to say Europeans discovered it in the 15th century because the earlier Viking settlement was abandoned and forgotten by the vikings themselves so was new information in the 15th C


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 11:06 pm
 


Quote:
Europeans didn't "discover" North America, the Chinese beat them to it but

Technically, the Vikings were still 400-500 years before Zheng He. Vinland is thought to be modern day Newfoundland.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 12:20 am
 


Oh my F#%+*n God. Nobody has mentioned the frickin Solutreans yet. You guys are letting the poor old disparaged white man down. SHAME!


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 15, 2019 6:49 pm
 


llama66 wrote:
Quote:
Europeans didn't "discover" North America, the Chinese beat them to it but

Technically, the Vikings were still 400-500 years before Zheng He. Vinland is thought to be modern day Newfoundland.


I’m sorry guys but China did not discover the Americas or ever sail here before Europeans in past centuries. That book is widely panned by historians and the author who wrote it is a novelist who writes fiction with no background in history.


Last edited by BeaverFever on Sun Sep 15, 2019 7:49 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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