[Gunnair]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

and all Jews are acceptable targets

Victims deserve what they get in Curt's world.

[Curtman]

Yeah, that poor road. It really deserved what it got.

Can roads even be Jewish? I thought they could only be Israeli.

[CrazyNewfie]

WTF are you people talking about? Read Curtman's last post, these are people trying to keep their land and homes from being taken from them, and the Israeli's bomb the fuck out of them killing women and children in the process with no remorse.
Fuck I hate this world, full of slimy, selfish bastards with no remorse or empathy for other people. Seems the only concern people have is me, me, me, give me more land, money, power. I think we are doomed to blow the fuck out of ourselves, how can we survive as a species when the only characteristic of the people in charge that even remotely resembles a human being is greed?

[Lemmy]

It doesn't matter who's right and who's wrong. What's the solution? There are only 3 possible long-term outcomes that I can envision:
1. Palestine is granted nationhood, independent from Israel, so that Israel can maintain itself as a Jewish state;
2. Irsael grants Palestinians equal citizenship within a united, bi-faith state, thereby conceding that, given that Palestinians will significantly outnumber Jews in a decade, the Israeli government will become dominated by Palestinians (just like what happened in South Africa);
3. Israel becomes an apartheid state, just like South Africa used to be, suffering the disdain of the global community (embargoed, etc).

So which is it going to be?

[Gunnair]

CrazyNewfie CrazyNewfie:

WTF are you people talking about? Read Curtman's last post, these are people trying to keep their land and homes from being taken from them, and the Israeli's bomb the fuck out of them killing women and children in the process with no remorse.
Fuck I hate this world, full of slimy, selfish bastards with no remorse or empathy for other people. Seems the only concern people have is me, me, me, give me more land, money, power. I think we are doomed to blow the fuck out of ourselves, how can we survive as a species when the only characteristic of the people in charge that even remotely resembles a human being is greed?

Finished? Good.

Your emotive meandering rant aside, the only umbrage I took with Curt's post was the typical blaming of the victim that he spins out with the predictability of toilet plugging on a Carnival cruise ship - and about as smelly as well.

[martin14]

Lemmy Lemmy:

It doesn't matter who's right and who's wrong. What's the solution? There are only 3 possible long-term outcomes that I can envision:
1. Palestine is granted nationhood, independent from Israel, so that Israel can maintain itself as a Jewish state;
2. Irsael grants Palestinians equal citizenship within a united, bi-faith state, thereby conceding that, given that Palestinians will significantly outnumber Jews in a decade, the Israeli government will become dominated by Palestinians (just like what happened in South Africa);
3. Israel becomes an apartheid state, just like South Africa used to be, suffering the disdain of the global community (embargoed, etc).

So which is it going to be?

2. will never happen. The bloodshed would make Syria look like a high school fight.

3. might happen, but even Barak can't put a dent into what is the only functioning
democracy in the region. I doubt it.


1. Might happen, if shit like this ever actually stops. The biggest impediment to Palestinian nationhood are the Palis themselves.

[Gunnair]

martin14 martin14:

Lemmy Lemmy:

It doesn't matter who's right and who's wrong. What's the solution? There are only 3 possible long-term outcomes that I can envision:
1. Palestine is granted nationhood, independent from Israel, so that Israel can maintain itself as a Jewish state;
2. Irsael grants Palestinians equal citizenship within a united, bi-faith state, thereby conceding that, given that Palestinians will significantly outnumber Jews in a decade, the Israeli government will become dominated by Palestinians (just like what happened in South Africa);
3. Israel becomes an apartheid state, just like South Africa used to be, suffering the disdain of the global community (embargoed, etc).

So which is it going to be?

2. will never happen. The bloodshed would make Syria look like a high school fight.

3. might happen, but even Barak can't put a dent into what is the only functioning
democracy in the region. I doubt it.


1. Might happen, if shit like this ever actually stops. The biggest impediment to Palestinian nationhood are the Palis themselves.

Israel rarely helps the situation with the hammer they weild to crush the mosquitoes that bother them.

[raydan]

True Gun... I don't think that the blame lies on only one side in this conflict... it rarely does.

[martin14]

Gunnair Gunnair:

Israel rarely helps the situation with the hammer they weild to crush the mosquitoes that bother them.

If it was your children being shelled on a daily basis,
I doubt you would call this 'mosquitoes'.

[ShepherdsDog]

Ray it would be like me punching you in the head for the actions of the FLQ and the policies of the PQ. The people of Ashkelon aren't setting up settlements in Judea or Samaria(West Bank)...or Gaza where the rockets are coming from. They live a few minutes south of Tel Aviv in an Israeli city on the Mediterranean coast.

[raydan]

But you know it DOES work that way Shep. When the Germans bombed London, they weren't really aiming for military installations and didn't care if they killed civilians, same thing when we bombed Berlin and again when they dropped those 2 bombs on Japan.

[ShepherdsDog]

Yet the Israelis are always deserving of rocket attacks and the Arabs are always victims. You'd think the West Bank Arabs would be the ones doing the rocket launches against Israeli settlements but it's the Gazans...where Israel pulled out ....who are launching rockets at Israeli towns and villages built in Israel proper.

[Curtman]

martin14 martin14:

Gunnair Gunnair:

Israel rarely helps the situation with the hammer they weild to crush the mosquitoes that bother them.

If it was your children being shelled on a daily basis,
I doubt you would call this 'mosquitoes'.

One 8" projectile in 3 months hitting a road in and industrial area is what now?

Drama.

[bootlegga]

Lemmy Lemmy:

It doesn't matter who's right and who's wrong. What's the solution? There are only 3 possible long-term outcomes that I can envision:
1. Palestine is granted nationhood, independent from Israel, so that Israel can maintain itself as a Jewish state;
2. Irsael grants Palestinians equal citizenship within a united, bi-faith state, thereby conceding that, given that Palestinians will significantly outnumber Jews in a decade, the Israeli government will become dominated by Palestinians (just like what happened in South Africa);
3. Israel becomes an apartheid state, just like South Africa used to be, suffering the disdain of the global community (embargoed, etc).

Ideally, it would be #1, but there are dozens of impediments to that.

Gunnair Gunnair:

martin14 martin14:

So which is it going to be?

2. will never happen. The bloodshed would make Syria look like a high school fight.

3. might happen, but even Barak can't put a dent into what is the only functioning
democracy in the region. I doubt it.


1. Might happen, if shit like this ever actually stops. The biggest impediment to Palestinian nationhood are the Palis themselves.

Israel rarely helps the situation with the hammer they weild to crush the mosquitoes that bother them.

Yep, I'd contend that there is plenty of blame to go around.

That being said, I have little empathy for the Palestinians who rolled the dice and gambled in 1948, thinking they were going to roll over the Jews and kick them all out.

I just wish the Israelis used a little more restraint when they retaliated - every time they kill a dozen civilians, they create a couple dozen more recruits for Hamas/Hezbollah and every other terrorist organization in the Middle East. And that makes any kind of settlement even more remote.

Frankly, it's getting to the point where I don't really care what happens to either side.

[Gunnair]

martin14 martin14:

Gunnair Gunnair:

Israel rarely helps the situation with the hammer they weild to crush the mosquitoes that bother them.

If it was your children being shelled on a daily basis,
I doubt you would call this 'mosquitoes'.

That's an emotive appeal that seeks to end discussion and provide justification. That is not happening to us which allows us to pursue a more thoughtful debate...at least it should.