[Jabberwalker]

The current government has been in power long enough to have had replacements on the ways right now. They have truly dropped the ball. There is no excuse for this but incompetent political leadership.

... and I am a Conservative ... a very unhappy one. Maybe I and a few million others like me can become convinced to fire those guys next year.

[PublicAnimalNo9]

There's nothing like being a three ocean nation with a Great Lakes navy.

/sarcasm off

[Freakinoldguy]

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

The current government has been in power long enough to have had replacements on the ways right now. They have truly dropped the ball. There is no excuse for this but incompetent political leadership.

... and I am a Conservative ... a very unhappy one. Maybe I and a few million others like me can become convinced to fire those guys next year.

I'd say I agree and like you would likely vote for someone other than the Tories but, given the alternatives I just don't know who, since neither of the other choices appear to be anymore inclined towards protecting the military than the current regime.

It's time for our country to stop playing financial politics with the military and do the right thing because it's been going on far to long. Chretien sent his "Boy Scouts" into harms way undermanned and under equipped and now Harper has gutted the RCN by his inaction and blatant lies about military spending.

But the ultimate blame for this debacle lays with the public, of which a majority couldn't care less if we had a military or not until they need it. If the populace really wants a strong military they have to speak up for it otherwise, the Gov't will continue to use it as their own personal social engineering experiment and punching bag for a series of finance ministers to score points on by continually underfunding or robbing from it.

[saturn_656]

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/national/ ... s-of-ships

$1:

ESQUIMALT — As the Royal Canadian Navy undergoes its most extensive peacetime modernization in history, Vice Admiral Mark Norman, Commander of the Royal Canadian Navy (RCN), today announced the upcoming retirement of four ships that have reached the end of their operational lives, a news release issued by the RCN noted.

More from the release just sent out a few minutes ago:

The ships are Her Majesty’s Canadian Ships (HMCS) Protecteur and Preserver; two Protecteur-class auxiliary oil replenishment (AOR) ships, and HMCS Iroquois and Algonquin, two Iroquois-class guided missile destroyers (DDG). The retirement of these vessels has been anticipated for some time, and is a step towards the introduction of new ships and capabilities set to be delivered through the National Shipbuilding Procurement Strategy (NSPS), as well as recognition of the RCN’s commitment to the responsible use of public funds while maintaining Canada’s naval readiness.

Quick Facts

Preparing for the future fleet

· The Royal Canadian Navy (RCN) is in the midst of the most intensive and comprehensive period of fleet modernization and renewal in its peacetime history. It does so while also maintaining its readiness.

· This period of transition includes the modernization of its 12 Halifax-class frigates and the procurement of three new classes of ships, including the Joint Support Ships (JSS), the Arctic/Offshore Patrol Ships (AOPS) and the Canadian Surface Combatants (CSC), as well as the integration of new maritime aircraft into fleet service.

· During this period of transition, the RCN will be able to count on its modernized Halifax-class frigates delivered by the Government of Canada, Victoria-class submarines and Kingston-class vessels to carry out the tasks and missions set by the Government of Canada.

· The Government of Canada is delivering equipment to the Navy by investing $4 billion to modernize the Halifax-class frigates, and $36.6 billion on the National Shipbuilding Procurement Strategy (NSPS) for the recapitalization of the federal surface fleet during the coming decades.

· The RCN has a plan in place to address the many challenges of transition, including the need to maintain excellence in operations, to deliver the future fleet and to prepare the RCN for the new capabilities and technologies that will be delivered through the NSPS over the next decade and beyond.

HMCS Iroquois

· HMCS Iroquois is a guided missile destroyer (DDG) and the lead ship of the Iroquois Class, which comprises HMCS Athabaskan on the East Coast, and HMCS Algonquin on the West Coast.

· HMCS Iroquois has been scheduled for divestment since November 2011.

· HMCS Iroquois will prepare for its official paying off ceremony in January 2015 in Halifax, Nova Scotia.

HMCS Algonquin

· HMCS Algonquin is a guided missile destroyer (DDG), the fourth ship of the Iroquois Class.

· On August 30, 2013, HMCS Algonquin was involved in a collision at sea with HMCS Protecteur while conducting exercise manoeuvres en route to Hawaii. There were no injuries. The ship was able to return to its home port of Esquimalt, BC, to undergo a full damage assessment.

· It was assessed that HMCS Algonquin suffered extensive damage to its port side hangar and remained alongside in Esquimalt.

· Considering the relatively short service life remaining for HMCS Algonquin, which was scheduled to be retired in early 2019, and its current state of repair, the cost to re-instate this ship to full operational capability no longer represents a responsible use of public funds. As a result, HMCS Algonquin will begin preparations for pay off in the near future.

· A Board of Inquiry was convened to further investigate the incident and circumstances surrounding it, and will make recommendations as to how to prevent a similar event from occurring in the future.

HMCS Protecteur

· HMCS Protecteur is an Auxiliary Oil Replenishment (AOR) ship based in Esquimalt, BC, and the lead ship of the Protecteur Class. Its sister ship, HMCS Preserver, is based in Halifax, NS.

· HMCS Protecteur was designed to carry a large amount of supplies, including fuel, dry cargo and ammunition, which could be transferred to other ships through hook-up lines and re-fuelling hoses in a manoeuvre known as a Replenishment at Sea.

· HMCS Protecteur will be officially retired after sustaining serious damage in a fire in February 2014. An extensive assessment of HMCS Protecteur has concluded that the ship was damaged beyond economical repair.

· Considering the relatively short service life remaining for HMCS Protecteur, which was scheduled to be retired in 2017, and its current state of repair, the cost to re-instate the ship to full operational capability would not represent a responsible use of public funds. As a result, the ship will remain alongside and be prepared for disposal as early as is practically feasible.

· A Board of Inquiry (BOI) has been convened to investigate the cause of the fire on board HMCS Protecteur and the circumstances surrounding it. The BOI, which is still ongoing, will make recommendations as to how to prevent a similar event from occurring in the future, and its results will be made public when available.

HMCS Preserver

· HMCS Preserver is rapidly approaching the end of its operational life, which was planned for 2016.

· Engineering surveys conducted in recent months identified levels of corrosion in HMCS Preserver that have degraded the structural integrity of the ship below acceptable limits, specifically in the vicinity of the port side boiler room.

· As a result of its current material state, and considering the relatively short service life remaining for HMCS Preserver, the cost to reinstate this ship to full operational capability does not represent a responsible use of public funds. HMCS Preserver will therefore cease its operational life, remain alongside and prepare for pay off in the near future.

[saturn_656]

No word on how to cover the capability gaps, just that the Kingston's, Victoria's, and Halifax's will "handle everything".

No mention that nearly half the Kingston's are laid up, only one or two of the Victoria's work properly and not all of the frigates are even available for operations.

Thanks for the BS filled news release Admiral Mouthpiece.

[BeaverFever]

$1:

No mention that nearly half the Kingston's are laid up

I've heard tha the Kingstons aren't so useful anyway, but I defer to others on here who would know more than me.

As for the announcement, Key words highlighted:

$1:

the recapitalization of the federal surface fleet during the coming decades.

Not a fleet recaptialized for the coming decades but during the coming decades. As in, it will be decades before we have the fleet recapitalized.

$1:

new capabilities and technologies that will be delivered through the NSPS over the next decade and beyond.

Speaks for itself.

[Vamp018]

What is sad is Canada's Navy falls behind Mexico's Navy and Brazil's.

[saturn_656]

http://www.sunnewsnetwork.ca/sunnews/po ... 55401.html

The Conservatives are mothballing the Navy, and the NDP of all parties are giving them flak.

It's like a bloody Monty Python skit.

[Jabberwalker]

The really sad part is that those 280 New Tribals were, for a brief moment in history, the most advanced of that type of warship on the planet when they were launched. They were revolutionary in that they were the first all-gas-turbine powered ones (pre-Arabian oil crisis design) in a world that was still all steam turbine of some sort (nuclear included on that list). Gas turbine is almost instant power, going from cold metal to full power in about 90 seconds, this in contrast to the four hours required to get up steam pressure. Also, Canada was a pioneer in flying big helicopters off of small ships ... but TWO big helicopters was ground breaking. They are really beautiful and capable ships. They had better preserve one of them as a point of national pride.

I vote for "Iroquois".

[saturn_656]

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/national/ ... er-vessels

Apparently the crews of these four ships will be sent to the frigates (shouldn't they already have crews?), MCDV's (looks like some of them are being reactivated, as if those little tin cans could fill in for a destroyer), and the AOPS (construction has not even begun, are they supposed to play make believe?)

More hot air from Adm Mouthpiece.

[saturn_656]

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

The really sad part is that those 280 New Tribals were, for a brief moment in history, the most advanced of that type of warship on the planet when they were launched. They were revolutionary in that they were the first all-gas-turbine powered ones (pre-Arabian oil crisis design) in a world that was still all steam turbine of some sort (nuclear included on that list). Gas turbine is almost instant power, going from cold metal to full power in about 90 seconds, this in contrast to the four hours required to get up steam pressure. Also, Canada was a pioneer in flying big helicopters off of small ships ... but TWO big helicopters was ground breaking. They are really beautiful and capable ships. They had better preserve one of them as a point of national pride.

I vote for "Iroquois".

It'll be her or 282. 283 is all smashed to shit.

My bet is on 282. Sounds like Iroquois is being stripped for parts.

[Jabberwalker]

They are so fecking beautiful ... the pinnacle of Canadian ship design (Patrol Frigates notwithstanding). They had better preserve one ... and not as a goddam dive wreck, either. They managed to dispose of all the DDEs and DDHs without leaving one for our grandchildren to tour. I believe that someone tried to preserve the Fraser but it rusted to buts, instead.

[saturn_656]

$1:

Norman said he's confident that the navy can meet its commitments.
The destroyers were Cold War sub killers launched in the 1970s. They were refitted in the 1990s as command-and-control ships and area air-defence vessels.
Norman said he expects the frigates can replace them, for the most part, although their anti-aircraft missiles aren't as far-reaching.
"In many respects, a modern, highly capable frigate like we're producing in the Halifax class through the modernization, is as capable in most respects if not more capable than what is now 20-year old technology in the legacy Iroquois class."
The navy is looking at ways to replace the supply ships, which were used to refuel and resupply ships at sea. Replacements aren't due until 2019 at the earliest.
"Options include potential enhancements, or additions, to existing agreements with key allies, as well as some made-in-Canada solutions," Norman said. He wouldn't go into details, but said other navies needing a temporary fix to such a shortage have borrowed vessels or refitted civilian tankers.

He seems pretty confident that the frigates can fill in no problem. Maybe they would be able to if they were properly refit, but they aren't.

We could have installed dual packed launchers to double the ESSM capacity to 32 but we didn't.

We didn't install an appropriate radar. Thales SMART-S is intended for light frigates/OPV/support ships. We also are retaining the legacy Sea Giraffe radar.

Only two of the ships were/are to be set up as stop gap command and control platforms.

[BartSimpson]

Jabberwalker Jabberwalker:

They are so fecking beautiful ... the pinnacle of Canadian ship design (Patrol Frigates notwithstanding). They had better preserve one ... and not as a goddam dive wreck, either. They managed to dispose of all the DDEs and DDHs without leaving one for our grandchildren to tour. I believe that someone tried to preserve the Fraser but it rusted to buts, instead.

No offense intended, but your fellow citizens are averse to the military and aside from the lingering memories of WW1 it seems to me they'd rather forget that Canada ever had a military, let alone permit another reminder of it to persist.

[saturn_656]

I think the most recent warships that became Museums in Canada were two of the three Oberons.

Given that none of our Cold War surface fleet has been retained as a museum either 280 or 282 should be.