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PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2019 3:57 pm
 


Sunnyways wrote:
Dual citizenship has been a smouldering issue for years in many situations, and as nativist sentiment gathers steam it won’t be going away any time soon. I would draw the line at party leaders, Cabinet ministers and the GG - if you’re that senior you should have no other citizenship. We know ordinary MPs don’t matter. May should renounce her US citizenship if she still has it. The Americans are good friends but they have many peculiar rules e.g. US persons and tax liability. It’s better to be above suspicion of foreign allegiances.

Has it really been a growing issue? It seems to me to be an issue of convenience. Only ever considered a negative during the election campaign, and part of Canada's strength of diversity the rest of the time.

Wouldn't that automatically exclude a massive percentage of our population from a Canadian right?

Is this a path we want to follow others on?

That all being said, if our highest echelons can not be foreign born, than no MP can be foreign born. We would only ever be one unfortunate event away from a constitutional crisis (we would have to modify our constitution to restrict this).
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For the Tories, Scheer is going to lose time explaining himself. It’s an unforced error and it ties into a Liberal narrative that the Tories are American lapdogs.

If I was Scheer, I would just hold up a placard with a Liberal MP quoted, "Other than our Indigenous nation, everyone else came to Canada from somewhere else," she said. "It's really amazing to see such a big diversity in the House of Commons, because it really is important that people see themselves represented." (MP Salma Zahid).

Granted, this isn't why Scheer is going to be opposition at best (hope), so I hope he does focus on it.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2019 4:11 pm
 


Quote:
It seems to me to be an issue of convenience.


It came up in another context outside politics:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadia ... onvenience


Quote:
Only ever considered a negative during the election campaign, and part of Canada's strength of diversity the rest of the time.

Wouldn't that automatically exclude a massive percentage of our population from a Canadian right?

Is this a path we want to follow others on?


It’s something Scheer himself raised about Michaëlle Jean so he can hardly cry foul now.

https://nationalpost.com/pmn/elections- ... ion-stance

Conservatives also criticized Mulcair and Dion for holding French citizenship.



Quote:
That all being said, if our highest echelons can not be foreign born, than no MP can be foreign born. We would only ever be one unfortunate event away from a constitutional crisis (we would have to modify our constitution to restrict this).


Foreign birth is not the issue (and both Mulcair and Dion were born in Canada); senior politicians retaining foreign citizenship is. As a foreign-born dual citizen myself, I don’t object to dual citizenship at all for people in ordinary jobs but senior political positions are different. What would some of us think if a citizen of the People’s Republic of China became PM and if he or she forgot to mention that fact before they took the top job? If we can’t change the law, we could at least make it a custom that party leaders declare their citizenship when taking office and make a reasonable effort to divest themselves of any foreign claims on their allegiance.


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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 12:46 pm
 


FPTP doesn’t work well with more than two parties and favours regional parties. I guess Canadians are going to have to learn that lesson a few more times before they get it.

Scheer has his good points: unglamorous; no trust fund; a concern with balancing the budget; not as keen on immigration. He’s more like Chrétien than the Trudeaus. However, he has made entirely avoidable errors on abortion, same-sex marriage, citizenship and an extremely brief career in insurance. The handlers should have prepared him better.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2019 10:38 am
 


'Still a bit confused': The splintering of Canada's progressive vote

With just over two weeks to go before Canadians cast their ballots, there remains much uncertainty over how those who lean left intend to vote


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One of the unmistakable takeaways of the 2015 federal election was that left-leaning Canadian voters were relatively united in their vote. The Liberal Party of Canada won 184 seats (a gain of 148 seats) and the NDP clinched 44 seats, losing much of its political dominance in Quebec. The Green Party, not unlike previous elections, won just one seat — that of party leader Elizabeth May.

With just over two weeks to go before Canadians cast their ballots again, there remains much confusion over how exactly those who lean left intend to vote this time around. Most polls are projecting just over a third of voters to vote Liberal, 15 per cent to vote for the NDP, and 10 per cent for the Greens. Although climate, healthcare and affordability rank as major concerns for voters on both ends of the political spectrum, there has been no clear cut ballot box issue on the left, one that could potentially unite progressive voters.

David Coletto, CEO of the polling firm Abacus Data, believes that the Liberals’ 2015 sweep was essentially a vote for change. “Trudeau projected hope and change. There is nothing quite binding the non-conservative vote this time,” he says.

Strategists are calling this the “splintering” of the progressive vote, attributed in part to growing awareness and interest in climate issues (and the subsequent association of the Green Party with that cause) and to some extent, a broader dissatisfaction with Justin Trudeau’s projection as a champion of liberal causes versus his execution of them.

“This election is a cloud of gas. It really lacks definition. Most of the emotion in this campaign is on the right and it is because of their disenchantment with Trudeau. The left is still a bit confused,” said Darrell Bricker, chief executive of polling firm Ipsos Public Affairs.

“If you’re a progressive voter, you have three options: the Liberals, the NDP and the Green Party. If you’re a progressive voter and you’re disappointed with the Liberals, you will consider the Greens or the NDP. If you find the NDP wanting, that makes the Greens look interesting, so it essentially all starts with dissatisfaction of the incumbent...”


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 06, 2019 10:43 am
 


I have a theory I'm anxious to check out concerning polling this election.

I believe year after year poll results are getting more and more skewed.

Basically, the doxxing, censoring, depersonning, cancel culture section of the left-wing have made conservatives or the right-wing bent in general more reluctant to agree to do polls and surveys and justified in hanging up. I know it has me.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:24 am
 


Conservatives are more like Catholics and liberals more like Prods. There will always be more parties on the left. The first item on any proper progressive party’s agenda is the next split. .


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:30 am
 


More the other way around. The Liberal's slavish worship of anything named Trudeau approaches the Catholic way of venerating the popes and obeying their every command, no matter how corrupt, morally rotten, or outright stupid they are.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 8:32 am
 


peck420 wrote:
Sunnyways wrote:
Dual citizenship has been a smouldering issue for years in many situations, and as nativist sentiment gathers steam it won’t be going away any time soon. I would draw the line at party leaders, Cabinet ministers and the GG - if you’re that senior you should have no other citizenship. We know ordinary MPs don’t matter. May should renounce her US citizenship if she still has it. The Americans are good friends but they have many peculiar rules e.g. US persons and tax liability. It’s better to be above suspicion of foreign allegiances.


Has it really been a growing issue? It seems to me to be an issue of convenience. Only ever considered a negative during the election campaign, and part of Canada's strength of diversity the rest of the time.


Personally, I don't really think it is a big issue.

However, it was used to great effect in 2011 on Ignatief, as well as against Mulcair in 2012, so it's some sweet poetic justice that someone who once questioned other politician's loyalty to Canada is getting a taste of his own medicine. :twisted:


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 9:33 am
 


bootlegga wrote:
peck420 wrote:
Sunnyways wrote:
Dual citizenship has been a smouldering issue for years in many situations, and as nativist sentiment gathers steam it won’t be going away any time soon. I would draw the line at party leaders, Cabinet ministers and the GG - if you’re that senior you should have no other citizenship. We know ordinary MPs don’t matter. May should renounce her US citizenship if she still has it. The Americans are good friends but they have many peculiar rules e.g. US persons and tax liability. It’s better to be above suspicion of foreign allegiances.


Has it really been a growing issue? It seems to me to be an issue of convenience. Only ever considered a negative during the election campaign, and part of Canada's strength of diversity the rest of the time.


Personally, I don't really think it is a big issue.

However, it was used to great effect in 2011 on Ignatief, as well as against Mulcair in 2012, so it's some sweet poetic justice that someone who once questioned other politician's loyalty to Canada is getting a taste of his own medicine. :twisted:

More just shows what hypocritical pieces of garbage politicians are.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 9:57 am
 


And it also shows, once again, what a total garbage election this one it turning out to be. Garbage choices and with a garbage outcome no matter who wins because the only thing that is guaranteed is that things will get even crappier and more disgusting than they already are right now.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:09 am
 


Thanos wrote:
And it also shows, once again, what a total garbage election this one it turning out to be. Garbage choices and with a garbage outcome no matter who wins because the only thing that is guaranteed is that things will get even crappier and more disgusting than they already are right now.

I'm staying off Facebook because the election's such a shit show that only stokes my assholish side.


Last edited by FieryVulpine on Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:10 am
 


The world will be a better place when we stop voting for/listening to/electing politicians.


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:21 am
 


FieryVulpine wrote:
Thanos wrote:
And it also shows, once again, what a total garbage election this one it turning out to be. Garbage choices and with a garbage outcome no matter who wins because the only thing that is guaranteed is that things will get even crappier and more disgusting than they already are right now.

I'm staying off Facebook because the election's such a shit show that only stokes my assholish side.


Twitter is nothing but liberal/left-wing dipshit carnage right now. Scheer's citizenship is a total atrocity to the mob but Trudeau's blackface and SNC Lavalin is now ancient history. Anyone want to tell me the mental or emotional difference between a Trudeau supporter and a Trump one? Both tribes come across like they were separated at birth but still share some kind of a hive-brain given how fast they are to totally exonerate Their Guy no matter what he does. :?


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:41 pm
 


Thanos wrote:
Twitter is nothing but liberal/left-wing dipshit carnage right now. Scheer's citizenship is a total atrocity to the mob but Trudeau's blackface and SNC Lavalin is now ancient history. Anyone want to tell me the mental or emotional difference between a Trudeau supporter and a Trump one? Both tribes come across like they were separated at birth but still share some kind of a hive-brain given how fast they are to totally exonerate Their Guy no matter what he does. :?


I quit Twitter because it was giving me literal panic attacks. I'm not proud of it, and I know I'm probably shirking my responsibilities to take in a wide variety of perspectives and to participate myself, and my responsibilities to Canada by extension, but it was causing too much harm for me personally. The irony was that my own personal interactions with people were almost always positive-it was seeing some of what other people twisted that nearly drove me crazy.

All I can say in my own defence is that I've been keeping up with following and compiling the news on my Medium site...and even that's no excuse for not keeping up with my readings of my various Canadian-related books and magazines, or of posting here more often. :(


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