[Scape]

xerxes wrote:

Just to jump in here, there is also the issue of time around. Rush et. al. have been around for years where Air America is still relatively new and still struggling to make inroads.

Exactly my point. Market penetration is going to be hard when the guy they have on AFR comes across as a bland liberal and he goes up vs Rush.

xerxes wrote:

That said, I think the whole idea of a liberal counter to conservative talk radio was a bad idea. Radio is old school, the internet is the future of widespread political discourse and that's already being borne out. The liberal websites out there are far more organised and effective as tools for mobilising like-minded individuals than their conservative counterparts are.

I disagree, talk radio and the net complement each other very well and it's hard to get access to the web when your in remote areas or not at a keyboard (driving). The banter is current affairs and it is best to talk about when the issue is breaking be it that day or week and have an audience of peers to review it with. Blogs are great for that but they don't have the real time reaction as radio or the guiding direction of the radio pundit be that a Rush/Hannity or a Malloy/Miller that put the issue into context.

[Psudo]

Scape wrote:

The best way to harm an idea is to weakly defend it and it is not the MSM or the comedy networks intent to be the voice of the progressive movement.

Frankly, I think Jon Stewart does a great job. This latest election seems to indicate the left has all the media outlets they need. But I'm speaking from outside the progressive movement; maybe the perspective from within is different.

hwacker, don't be an idiot. Zipperfish subtly insults conservative radio, and you jump at the bait and heartily agree. Way to prove Scape's point about a weak defense.

xerxes wrote:

I think the whole idea of a liberal counter to conservative talk radio was a bad idea. Radio is old school, the internet is the future of widespread political discourse

AM Radio was already old school before Rush appeared on the scene. It's success over the past two decades was through innovative programming, not innovative technology. I agree with Scape that radio punditry will remain a political power for some time.

Scape, I don't understand your complaint about competition in radio. Are you claiming there is some injustice at play, or merely lamenting the lack of a liberal Limbaugh?

[Scape]

Oh Jon does a great job to be sure but like he answered in Crossfire he is a comic, the show leading up to him is puppets doing crank phone calls. He is not or ever should be confused with the progressive prospective.

As to your last question I cite only that there is a lag not an injustice. The market should correct but the Rush has a head start with the companies that transmit and the audience that receives. Habits form over time so I am fully confident that there will be a wider variety then the current crop. You have to admit that there is a shortfall in the interim however.

PS. Telling Hwacker not to be an idiot is like telling a fish not to swim. Good luck with that.

[hwacker]

Scape wrote:

Oh Jon does a great job to be sure but like he answered in Crossfire he is a comic, the show leading up to him is puppets doing crank phone calls. He is not or ever should be confused with the progressive prospective.

As to your last question I cite only that there is a lag not an injustice. The market should correct but the Rush has a head start with the companies that transmit and the audience that receives. Habits form over time so I am fully confident that there will be a wider variety then the current crop. You have to admit that there is a shortfall in the interim however.

PS. Telling Hwacker not to be an idiot is like telling a fish not to swim. Good luck with that.

Head start?

It's called hard work, If and that’s a huge if a liberal were to ever be as popular as "the Rush" it would take hold in about a year. Too bad there is no one from the Left that can entertain for 3 hours a day.

Jon the Jew has a hard enough time doing it for 30 minutes for 3 days a week. And radio would be way below Jon’s acceptable job description.

Bart is right, liberal talk radio will never fly, liberals have the MSM and they can have it.

[Psudo]

There is a constant ideological battle in my life between intelligent opponents convincing me I'm right and incompetent allies attacking that confidence. My life would be a lot easier if the other side had a monopoly on idiocy.

[CanadianJeff]

Sadly I'm starting to find it's the same on the left so your not alone. It's why I've been drifting to moderate conservative views the last few years. You are however most correct in that both ends have idiots.

Frankly I consider Rush one of them on the right. I vastly appreciate conservative radio in the morning when it uses it's brains. Thankfully there's a lot of great conservative radio coming out of Canada such as John Gormley.

[Scape]

[rant]I frankly can't stand my local radio. In today's age most portable radios now only carry FM and their range is pathetic. I end up with Kool FM which is great if I was a 15 year old girl or the Q which is good if I was 50+ as they only play music that 30 years old. With the exception of the CBC (which I don't consider really talk radio in this format) there is no options for someone who wants to hear something other than corporate media that is nothing but a playlist and a canned jock. Jack FM and the Ocean are the worst for that. I would love to hear something else and I know that on the AM dial there is CFAX that plugs into the Corus radio network which has some shows of interest and CKNW that has Bill Good but AM sucks for audio quality. There is a market for political talk radio in Canada but no one has yet to bring it for either the left or the right.[/rant]

I find US talk more interesting but Jerry Springer like. It does get ratings for that as it is after all entertainment. There is more heat/passion I find whereas the Canadian version is more cerebral. Cross country checkup is down right civil compared to most any US talk radio I have heard. Mind you I give more credence to CCC.

I do think that their is too much vitriol in the civil discourse of US talk radio. Shock loses its value after a while and you can change the horror to keep it fresh but after a while an immunity builds up like plaque. I don't want it to revert to CSPAN with commentary but I think focus has become somewhat fleeting when there seems to be a steady diet of red meat being dished out.

[brittly]

I agree.

[Psudo]

CanadianJeff wrote:

Frankly I consider Rush one of [the idiots] on the right.

A lot of people do. I disagree, but I'm kinda sick of arguing the point.

If you want to see how bias in his portrayal is common, compare Wikipedia's page on his Jargon with the Wikiquote page of his quotes. The former makes him seem like an entertainer with a wicked sense of humor, and the latter makes him look like a humorless racist creep. Clearly, cherry-picking quotes from a 20 year times 15 hours a week collection is highly effective at manipulating appearances.

(That's more than 15,600 hours of audio transcript, by the way.)

CanadianJeff wrote:

Thankfully there's a lot of great conservative radio coming out of Canada such as John Gormley.

Hey, that brings up a good point: who are the big names in Canadian Talk Radio? That'd be a great addendum to the chart I made.

Is there some publication that reports the audience size of Canadian talk radio shows?

[Terence]

I listen to Laura Ingraham every day, I have a paid membership - Laura365. She is a devout Reagan Republican and doesn't take a side in the neocon paleo fight on the right.

She is the only Conservative talk host who is pop culture literate. The female niche makes her opinion a bit more interesting than most shills. It is my guilty pleasure for 112 minutes a day (commercial free)

[commanderkai]

Zipperfish wrote:

Maybe the Liberals tend to be less bombastic than the Conservatvie talk show hosts and are therefore less entertaining.

If I remember correctly, Al Franken (not sure if I got his name right) was on Air America, and he is perceived as the left wing version of Rush Limbaugh (except with large doses more of insanity, but that might be because of my bias).

To say the conservative hosts are more radical, or bombastic seems to not be the cause, since Air America decided to find either equally or more radical host for their radio program.

[Terence]

I hate to say this, but I think it is fundamental to the comparison.

Conservative hosts tend to blend humour into their shows and entertain the audience. The Air America hosts were just too angry and I felt like they were lecturing too much.

People don't commit hours on a show to be told they are stupid. Respecting the audience is paramount to a radio shows success.

[Scape]

Al ran for senate (they are still counting) and his show was more shtick then issue based I thought. I didn't think he was anything of an anti-Rush. The female hosts such as Rachel Maddow (or as Hwacker affectionately calls 'that dyke') that did the opening segment on the headlines and then followed up with the war did a daily 3 hour program. She now has her own show on MSNBC and is the 1st progressive host I have seen of a MSM tv show. If your looking for a true Anti-Rush then that would be either Randi Rhodes or Mike Malloy. Randi does a lot of research but does come off as a bit uppity at times with her Brooklyn accent but New York is like that. Mike is a rip your throat out I hate republicans no holds barred and take no prisoners liberal. His rants are legendary if you want a true firebrand he would be it.

As for Air America itself, I don't tune in. Haven't since Randi left. They had a whole new management take over and it is just like real audio in that it was invasive and they tried to charge for everything. The only host I heard that was interesting was the Lionel show which to me sounds like a male version of Stephanie Miller with his gags and comedic spin. They also have The Young Turks which does have a lot of good banter. However with Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. that may have clout and interesting ideas his voice is like fingernails on chalk.

[hwacker]

Scape wrote:

Al ran for senate (they are still counting) and his show was more shtick then issue based I thought. I didn't think he was anything of an anti-Rush. The female hosts such as Rachel Maddow (or as Hwacker affectionately calls 'that dyke') that did the opening segment on the headlines and then followed up with the war did a daily 3 hour program. She now has her own show on MSNBC and is the 1st progressive host I have seen of a MSM tv show. If your looking for a true Anti-Rush then that would be either Randi Rhodes or Mike Malloy. Randi does a lot of research but does come off as a bit uppity at times with her Brooklyn accent but New York is like that. Mike is a rip your throat out I hate republicans no holds barred and take no prisoners liberal. His rants are legendary if you want a true firebrand he would be it.

As for Air America itself, I don't tune in. Haven't since Randi left. They had a whole new management take over and it is just like real audio in that it was invasive and they tried to charge for everything. The only host I heard that was interesting was the Lionel show which to me sounds like a male version of Stephanie Miller with his gags and comedic spin. They also have The Young Turks which does have a lot of good banter. However with Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. that may have clout and interesting ideas his voice is like fingernails on chalk.

Man Scape you spin just like a liberal, Rhodes was fired for having a vulgar vile mouth.

and



That's a guy

gotta stop getting your info from the daily kooks

[Scape]

For the chronically ignorant:

Quote:

Departure from Air America

Air America suspended Rhodes from the network on April 3, 2008 after an Air America affiliate, KKGN, event in San Francisco, California, where Rhodes said on March 22, 2008:

"Geraldine Ferraro turned out to be the David Duke in drag ... What a whore Geraldine Ferraro is! She's such a fucking whore! I wanna see her have to stand beside her husband at one of those mandatory 'I have sinned against you; I'm a whore' kind of a press conference. Mr. Ferraro should have to stand next to his whore of a wife ... Hillary is a big fucking whore, too. You know why she's a big fucking whore? Because her deal is always, 'Read the fine print, asshole!'"

When a video of the event was made public the following week, Air America suspended her for "inappropriate comments". The event was billed as "An Evening with Randi Rhodes" and promoted on KKGN's website.[9]

Rhodes claimed that Air America breached its contract with her, and questioned the network's commitment to free speech.[10][11][12]

On April 10, 2008, Rhodes went on Larry King Live to clarify her suspension from the network. Later that evening, she conducted an interview on The Mike Malloy Show in which Rhodes went into greater detail concerning the suspension. Air America had recently been sold. The new owner read her existing contract and wanted to amend two details: Rhodes' right to terminate at anytime, and a clause that said Air America could not terminate Rhodes for any reason without paying her. Rhodes refused to amend the contract, which she said took "seven months to negotiate with the previous owners."

Air America suspended her until a settlement could be reached concerning the contract which was still in place and had an additional year to run. In the interim, Air America management decided to conduct market research to assess her value to the company. According to Rhodes, it was Air America who released the press release that called attention to the video of her performance in San Francisco simply as a way to gauge her audience loyalty and her value to the network. According to Rhodes, Air America soon asked her to return to the air, with an offer of more money but still holding to the condition that she had to change her contract "in order to get her mic back". Rhodes refused and left Air America because of the stalemate over the new contract.[13]

Mark Green, President of Air America Radio, said, "Her abusive, obscene comments obviously crossed the line of what talent at a media company could say," and added that the comments "were in the Imus league," referring to radio host Don Imus, who was fired by CBS in 2007 after making racial remarks about female basketball players. According to a published account, Green said the company had asked Rhodes to apologize for the remarks. In the same account, Rhodes reportedly said that she did not refuse to apologize for the comment.[14]

Air America Media informed Rhodes on April 9 that the contract was terminated. Air America president Mark Green issued a statement wishing Rhodes well, and thanking her for her work with Air America. Meanwhile, KKGN announced on its website that The Randi Rhodes Show would return to Green 960 as of April 14, 2008.[14]

Air America also terminated access to The Randi Rhodes Show web site, redirecting it to a statement by the chairman and president on the Air America site. Rhodes stated at 3:42pm, EDT on April 14 that she, not Air America, owns the URL name. The message board was reinstated on May 5, 2008.

She had an unlimited contract and the new management wanted limits. They leaked the stand up as a way to strengthen their position. So she walked and went independent rather than come back on their terms.