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CKA Super Elite
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 3:12 am
 


Part 1




Part 2



ROTFL


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CKA Uber
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 3:27 am
 


hehe, I chuckled when I saw that and couldn't help to think of many discussion here and elsewhere. They agreed on some points, but disagreed on others. The big difference was in the Thought process behind each point-of-view.

Personally I side with MacLean on the argument and Thought Process, but Dons' explanation makes some sense too. I just think Don misses the difference between Euro Style of Hockey and Euro Players with Skills. They are not the same thing and one does not lead to the other. Don falls for the Generalization Trap with some assumptions added to fill in some spots.


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CKA Uber
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 6:30 am
 


sandorski wrote:
hehe, I chuckled when I saw that and couldn't help to think of many discussion here and elsewhere. They agreed on some points, but disagreed on others. The big difference was in the Thought process behind each point-of-view.

Personally I side with MacLean on the argument and Thought Process, but Dons' explanation makes some sense too. I just think Don misses the difference between Euro Style of Hockey and Euro Players with Skills. They are not the same thing and one does not lead to the other. Don falls for the Generalization Trap with some assumptions added to fill in some spots.


I swear the more I read of your posts sandorski, you must be my
diametric opposite in the world.. I knew there had to be one :)


Euro style and euro players... what the hell is the difference ?
Its exactly the same idea, emphasis on skills like skating, passing and shooting,
little emphasis on body checking and physical toughness.


Big reason why.. size of the rinks in Europe vs NA.. very difficult to close in
to someone in the European rinks, they are 20% bigger than what we have.

It encourages the other skills; passing, skating etc.. tough to hit a guy cause there is so much more room in European rinks, the system lends itself
to a different style of play.

Tough guy Euro player.. maybe 5 or 6 have adapted to a NA rough style out of the
150-200 euros in the NHL.. the rest still play the European style.

Don is 100% right, the sport is declining because the style of play is changing,
and it looks like some fans are turning away. Its maybe not just this reason,
but also ticket prices, and the complete lack of any 'dynasty' teams because
of the free agent system.. strike year probably didnt help either.

I have watched a few games over here, the style is different and Don
is right, as usual.. it is more boring..


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CKA Uber
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 6:36 am
 


I enjoy that you can hear the staff chuckle in the backgroung :lol:


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CKA Elite
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 6:59 am
 


I agree 100% with Grapes. What is happening in hockey is typical of what is happening in North America.... We are slowly losing our NA sovereignty... Toyota has surpassed GM, Sony has over RCA... Hockey is just a symptom of the Maurice Strong/ The Power Corp's push for globalization....

I wish more Canadians were true Canadians like Grapes...





PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 7:58 am
 


oh what a surprising post from Stemmer :lol:


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CKA Uber
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 8:59 am
 


ROTFL I love Grapes!!!


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 9:28 am
 


martin14 wrote:
Don is 100% right, the sport is declining because the style of play is changing, and it looks like some fans are turning away. Its maybe not just this reason, but also ticket prices, and the complete lack of any 'dynasty' teams because of the free agent system.. strike year probably didnt help either.


Ticket prices are an EFFECT of strong demand. If ticket prices are rising, interest in the game is rising in that market (whether corporate demand for tickets or fans'). To say that fans are turning away from the game because of increasing ticket prices is counter-intuitive to basic economics.

I think the proliferation of Europeans in the league IS causing demand for the sport to fall. I used to follow the NHL and the players much more closely 10 years ago. But now there's so many Europeans in the game, with names I can't pronounce or keep straight in my head, that I just don't follow the NHL that closely any more.


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CKA Elite
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 9:34 am
 


Excellent post Axeman, I agree 100%....Yeah...what's next allowing Toyota to participate in NASCAR races... Oh wait that's happening.... What a disgrace allowing non-North American manufacturers to run in a race for NA manufactures...

Grapes, I salute you for having the stones to say what many of us Canadians believe but are too cowardly to voice...!!!!





PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 9:38 am
 


stemmer wrote:
Excellent post Axeman, I agree 100%....Yeah...what's next allowing Toyota to participate in NASCAR races... Oh wait that's happening.... What a disgrace allowing non-North American manufacturers to run in a race for NA manufactures...

Grapes, I salute you for having the stones to say what many of us Canadians believe but are too cowardly to voice...!!!!


you don't like to see those Camrys beat your Impalas do you :lol:
especially since the Camry is built in the US.

What makes you more Canadian than the rest of us because you drive a GM..where was your computer screen made ? or your Camera?

pathetic :P

stick this in your hat.

"To most car shoppers, a Toyota Camry built in Georgetown, Ky., is as American as a Ford Five Hundred built in Chicago. Indeed, using the government's standards, both have 80 percent domestic parts."

http://www.boston.com/cars/news/article ... d_to_tell/


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CKA Uber
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 9:52 am
 


martin14 wrote:
sandorski wrote:
hehe, I chuckled when I saw that and couldn't help to think of many discussion here and elsewhere. They agreed on some points, but disagreed on others. The big difference was in the Thought process behind each point-of-view.

Personally I side with MacLean on the argument and Thought Process, but Dons' explanation makes some sense too. I just think Don misses the difference between Euro Style of Hockey and Euro Players with Skills. They are not the same thing and one does not lead to the other. Don falls for the Generalization Trap with some assumptions added to fill in some spots.


I swear the more I read of your posts sandorski, you must be my
diametric opposite in the world.. I knew there had to be one :)


Euro style and euro players... what the hell is the difference ?
Its exactly the same idea, emphasis on skills like skating, passing and shooting,
little emphasis on body checking and physical toughness.


Big reason why.. size of the rinks in Europe vs NA.. very difficult to close in
to someone in the European rinks, they are 20% bigger than what we have.

It encourages the other skills; passing, skating etc.. tough to hit a guy cause there is so much more room in European rinks, the system lends itself
to a different style of play.

Tough guy Euro player.. maybe 5 or 6 have adapted to a NA rough style out of the
150-200 euros in the NHL.. the rest still play the European style.

Don is 100% right, the sport is declining because the style of play is changing,
and it looks like some fans are turning away. Its maybe not just this reason,
but also ticket prices, and the complete lack of any 'dynasty' teams because
of the free agent system.. strike year probably didnt help either.

I have watched a few games over here, the style is different and Don
is right, as usual.. it is more boring..


Toughness is certainly needed, but that's why you have Goons on your Team. Every Player does not need to play that way and it needs to be noted that High Skill Plays are more memorable than Tough Plays(Body Checks, Fights). If a Team goes all Euro High Skill, then they'll play Euro Style, but having High Skill Euro Players on your mixed Team gives your team an edge that an all North American Tough Guy team would not have.


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CKA Elite
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 9:56 am
 


Mtbr...you're one dumbass... how is sending our money to Japan helping our North American companies?





PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 9:58 am
 


stemmer wrote:
Mtbr...you're one dumbass... how is sending our money to Japan helping our North American companies?



put the bottle down before you get close to the keyboard...you wouldn't want to spill on it and have to buy another foreign one to replace that foreign one.

My Microsoft (NA company) keyboard was made in China :lol:
how about yours?


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CKA Super Elite
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 10:19 am
 


sandorski wrote:
Toughness is certainly needed, but that's why you have Goons on your Team. Every Player does not need to play that way and it needs to be noted that High Skill Plays are more memorable than Tough Plays(Body Checks, Fights). If a Team goes all Euro High Skill, then they'll play Euro Style, but having High Skill Euro Players on your mixed Team gives your team an edge that an all North American Tough Guy team would not have.


Me being a life long Oiler fan I'm thinking I can describe more Semenko or Dave Brown fights than I can Gretzky goals.


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CKA Uber
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 01, 2009 10:56 am
 


Axeman wrote:
martin14 wrote:
Don is 100% right, the sport is declining because the style of play is changing, and it looks like some fans are turning away. Its maybe not just this reason, but also ticket prices, and the complete lack of any 'dynasty' teams because of the free agent system.. strike year probably didnt help either.


Ticket prices are an EFFECT of strong demand. If ticket prices are rising, interest in the game is rising in that market (whether corporate demand for tickets or fans'). To say that fans are turning away from the game because of increasing ticket prices is counter-intuitive to basic economics.

I think the proliferation of Europeans in the league IS causing demand for the sport to fall. I used to follow the NHL and the players much more closely 10 years ago. But now there's so many Europeans in the game, with names I can't pronounce or keep straight in my head, that I just don't follow the NHL that closely any more.


Not when the stadiums are half empty, as Don was mentioning.
When the stadium is full, sure there is pressure on prices.
While Don was complaining about half full rinks, then ticket price can
become an issue.. not the issue, mind you, but the people do not see value for money.


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