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Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'
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Author:  Newsbot [ Mon Jul 08, 2019 3:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

Title: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'
Category: Misc CDN
Posted By: N_Fiddledog
Date: 2019-07-08 13:19:09
Canadian

Author:  llama66 [ Mon Jul 08, 2019 3:09 pm ]
Post subject: 

Historical, Educational. End this madness.

Author:  raydan [ Mon Jul 08, 2019 3:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

If they don't get it back, they can come and see ours. :D

Image

Author:  BartSimpson [ Mon Jul 08, 2019 3:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

Can't believe that Canadians are copying this American madness of tearing down our history. :roll:

Author:  housewife [ Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

Neither can I Bart

Author:  Martin15 [ Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

Quote:
A plaque fixed to the monument states it was "erected to commemorate the advent into Ontario of the white race" under Champlain's leadership.


ROTFL

I'll bet the foundations of the statue were just fine.
Something else is rotten.

Meh.
It's only history, nothing important.

Author:  PublicAnimalNo9 [ Tue Jul 09, 2019 12:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

Funny eh? Being labeled a "racist" is cause for removing you from sight (or history altogether) but being a raging homophobe like Tommy Douglas was is just super cool as long as you're a socialist.

You know, like how being a nazi fascist is evil but being a red fascist is "progressive".

Or how half the population of North America seems to under the strange impression that slavery wasn't part of human history (for almost as long as human history) until some Black people got dragged to the New World against their will. I mean holy hell man, just about everyone engaged in slavery at one time or another but for some reason only Whitey gets the blame and all the hate.

Which beings up the ALT-left retards who whine about this land being stolen from the Natives and then demanding we have open borders. How much money has been spent on immigrants and refugees that COULD have gone to solving our own shameful third world problems right the fuck here!?

In a country that was as prosperous as Canada was, there's NO excuse for the continuing existence of third world conditions here. The Liberals have had decades on and off to do something about it. And yet they keep acting like they're the FN's best buddies. Well, they're certainly really good buddies with the Chiefs that are corrupt anyway.

Author:  stratos [ Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

Might be on my end but when I click on the link it says redirect blocked.

Author:  DrCaleb [ Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

stratos wrote:
Might be on my end but when I click on the link it says redirect blocked.


Try this one:

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/ma ... nadas-past

Author:  BartSimpson [ Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

PublicAnimalNo9 wrote:
Funny eh? Being labeled a "racist" is cause for removing you from sight (or history altogether) but being a raging homophobe like Tommy Douglas was is just super cool as long as you're a socialist.

You know, like how being a nazi fascist is evil but being a red fascist is "progressive".

Or how half the population of North America seems to under the strange impression that slavery wasn't part of human history (for almost as long as human history) until some Black people got dragged to the New World against their will. I mean holy hell man, just about everyone engaged in slavery at one time or another but for some reason only Whitey gets the blame and all the hate.

Which beings up the ALT-left retards who whine about this land being stolen from the Natives and then demanding we have open borders. How much money has been spent on immigrants and refugees that COULD have gone to solving our own shameful third world problems right the fuck here!?

In a country that was as prosperous as Canada was, there's NO excuse for the continuing existence of third world conditions here. The Liberals have had decades on and off to do something about it. And yet they keep acting like they're the FN's best buddies. Well, they're certainly really good buddies with the Chiefs that are corrupt anyway.


+5 for an exceptional 14,000th post!! R=UP

Author:  stratos [ Tue Jul 09, 2019 9:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

DrCaleb wrote:
stratos wrote:
Might be on my end but when I click on the link it says redirect blocked.


Try this one:

https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/ma ... nadas-past


Thanks it worked.

Author:  JaredMilne [ Wed Jul 10, 2019 7:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

If I can play devil's advocate (again), I think the real issue is how the Natives are depicted, notably being at the feet of the white priest and trader. I can't imagine any of us would like it if our ancestors were depicted that way.

I noted that an overwhelming majority of people were open to the idea of bringing the statue back with an expanded interpretation. That's the stance I'd take-and I wonder whether we need to bring back the sculptures of the Natives at the feet of the white people. The component that really matters is Champlain himself-what if they just brought that back with the expanded interpretation including the Native perspective?

Note that the expanded interpretation is a position that even many Native advocates agree with. Here's what I wrote in an essay on the subject last year:

Quote:

Fortunately, there might be a way forward, one endorsed by many Indigenous people themselves. Gitxsan activist Cindy Blackstock thinks that most statues and other memorials should remain in place to show people both the positive and ugly sides of historical figures’ legacies. Recently, Blackstock and Mohawk activist Ellen Gabriel participated in adding a new plaque to the gravesite of Duncan Campbell Scott, the Indian Affairs director who oversaw many of the most repressive parts of the Indigenous reserve and residential school systems. Gabriel talked about ‘humanizing’ Scott rather than ‘demonizing’ him, adding that Scott’s failings are those that humans in general are all too often guilty of. It’s a way to leave behind shame and guilt, and to take corrective actions.

Other Indigenous commentators such as the Native Council of Prince Edward Island, Sioux-Cree Kingston resident Dakota Ward, and Anishinaabe comedian Ryan McMahon agree that statues can function as teaching tools. Senator Sinclair also wrote about the need to build up Indigenous successes and accomplishments, a point the Native Council agreed with.

A (perhaps unintentional) example of the Indigenous perspective can be found in the statue of the Blackfoot leader Crowfoot at the Alberta Legislature. His comment that he was the first to sign Treaty 7, but that he would be the last to break it, would be all too prescient. That’s the sort of thing that can be further built on to show settler Canadians the Indigenous perspective.


Author:  DrCaleb [ Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

JaredMilne wrote:
If I can play devil's advocate (again), I think the real issue is how the Natives are depicted, notably being at the feet of the white priest and trader. I can't imagine any of us would like it if our ancestors were depicted that way.


That's exactly what I got from that Post article. We all know the relationship between Priests and First Nations. No need to celebrate that, unless you are a douchenozzle. And Traders weren't well respected then, pretty much as the role of 'pusher' is now. "Yankee Trader" was a bit of an insult then as well.

Author:  stratos [ Thu Jul 11, 2019 6:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

Quote:
And Traders weren't well respected then, pretty much as the role of 'pusher' is now.


interesting, the LIMITED history I learned of Canada and all that during the French ownership was that it was a very friendly relationship between Traders and Natives / FN's. Not to mention this was back in the 70's so ....

Author:  DrCaleb [ Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Samuel de Champlain monument: Hurtful or educational'

stratos wrote:
Quote:
And Traders weren't well respected then, pretty much as the role of 'pusher' is now.


interesting, the LIMITED history I learned of Canada and all that during the French ownership was that it was a very friendly relationship between Traders and Natives / FN's. Not to mention this was back in the 70's so ....


History written by the traders. ;)

Talk to the First Nations, and they tell a different story. Traders would give a pittance for furs, but always be willing to trade whisky for them. Create the dependence, then milk them for as much as they can produce. Give trinkets in return. Although, some of the most prized possessions of FNs were huge iron cooking pots, that were incredibly difficult to transport. But it took a village a whole year of trapping to be able to afford one.

I think even back to the 80's or 90's, it was rumored that there were places in Alberta that still had laws on the books where if you saw an 'Indian' on the streets after dark, you could shoot them. You can still shoot an Indian on horseback, if you are in a covered wagon, in North Dakota. ;)

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