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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:17 am
 


Stan Lee was simultaneously both the best and the worst thing to happen to comic book superheroes. He had a vision in thee early 1960's that superceded and then saved the business altogether when DC got too moribund and bogged down. He also though never grew up, like a perpetual teenager. It wasn't until the 1980's with Alan Moore and Frank Miller that the dumber tropes began to be left behind. Unfortunately though the movie universes seen to be stuck with the 1960's and 70's type of characterization when it comes to scripting dialogue.

This kind of goes to Scorcese's point when he got in trouble from the nerds for saying none of these movies were art. The genre wants to be taken seriously but at the same time can't help itself from devolving into camp and jokes. It's one thing to get the non-stop wisecracks from Peter Parker because the character was always that way. Iron Man or Thor weren't though. Seeing them do it too often goes against character. That sort of thing should be what makes the die-hard fans angry, not getting all torqued up in twitter-levels of outrage at Martin Scorcese or Francis Ford Copolla for telling the truth about these films.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:23 am
 


Thanos wrote:
It wasn't until the 1980's with Alan Moore and Frank Miller that the dumber tropes began to be left behind. Unfortunately though the movie universes seen to be stuck with the 1960's and 70's type of characterization when it comes to scripting dialogue.


I think it was back then when there was a controversial "Spider-Man" issue that didn't receive the approval from the "Comic Code Authority" because it dealt with the subject of drug overdoes. Imagine that! Heigth of the crack epidemic, and a comic book can't deal with the subject of drug overdoes.

I think that was when Marvel grew up. But DC didn't.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:27 am
 


DC dealt with drug addiction in the 1970's when one of Green Arrow's sidekicks got hooked on heroin. So there were some of the more serious issues that were being addressed. Thanks to the Comic Code though, as well as the general unwillingness of the industry to move past the kid's stuff, those stories were very few and far between.

My own thing right now is that, unless it's a really special story with a really great artist, I avoid reading the superhero stuff altogether. I'm just burnt out on it. It's become like porn in a way in that it's really just slightly different takes on the same scene over and over and over again. I really only read horror and sci-fi comic now because those are the only ones IMO that are doing anything interesting anymore.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:41 am
 


DC stayed stagnant because they didn't have any effective competition throughout most of the fifties after the imposition on the code aside from Dell and Archie, but the arrival Marvel changed that. Even then, DC was very slow to change and it wasn't until the late seventies when several Marvel writers jumped ship to DC that we saw that beginning to change. For example, Gerry Conway who famously wrote "The Night Gwen Stacy Died" co-created Firestorm, who was effectively DC's answer to Spider-Man. Then there was Marv Wolfman and George Perez on New Teen Titans, which challenged X-Men for top spot.

However, it wasn't until after Crisis on Infinite Earths that DC fully moved itself away from the Silver Age and "humanized" its characters.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 11:57 am
 


Both DC and Marvel have effectively given up on canon. In Marvel's case it's impossible to reconcile the book characters/stories with the movie versions. In DC's case they've done so many universe relaunches since Crisis in the 1980's that only a genius super-nerd can figure out what they've done with the timelines and such. It's simply too frustrating to keep track of. When it gets that serious it's probably time to give up on it altogether because such things shouldn't consume too much effort and concern because it takes all the basic fun out of it.

I really only seriously follow Garth Ennis now. His version of The Punisher, and then The Boys giving the superhero genre the slap across it's face that it always deserved, were the most refreshing hero stories I'd read in years. And his horror stories are usually genuinely disturbing. I can only follow the groundbreaking rebels like Ennis now. Everything else is just too bloated to waste time on.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:01 pm
 


Thanos wrote:
I really only seriously follow Garth Ennis now. His version of The Punisher, and then The Boys giving the superhero genre the slap across it's face that it always deserved, were the most refreshing hero stories I'd read in years. And his horror stories are usually genuinely disturbing. I can only follow the groundbreaking rebels like Ennis now. Everything else is just too bloated to waste time on.


Garth Ennis did Punisher?? {schoolgirl squeal of glee}

I love Ennis, but with Constantine and Mr.E. I had no idea he did Punisher. (I still have the Frank Zeck Punisher posters and issues)


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:07 pm
 


DrCaleb wrote:
Thanos wrote:
I really only seriously follow Garth Ennis now. His version of The Punisher, and then The Boys giving the superhero genre the slap across it's face that it always deserved, were the most refreshing hero stories I'd read in years. And his horror stories are usually genuinely disturbing. I can only follow the groundbreaking rebels like Ennis now. Everything else is just too bloated to waste time on.


Garth Ennis did Punisher?? {schoolgirl squeal of glee}

I love Ennis, but with Constantine and Mr.E. I had no idea he did Punisher. (I still have the Frank Zeck Punisher posters and issues)

Dude, Garth Ennis started his run on Punisher 20 years ago. Sounds like you have much material to catch up on.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:10 pm
 


FieryVulpine wrote:
DrCaleb wrote:

Garth Ennis did Punisher?? {schoolgirl squeal of glee}

I love Ennis, but with Constantine and Mr.E. I had no idea he did Punisher. (I still have the Frank Zeck Punisher posters and issues)

Dude, Garth Ennis started his run on Punisher 20 years ago. Sounds like you have much material to catch up on.


Yea, I quit buying comics about . . (looks at watch) . . . 25 years ago.

I still have them though. They take all that room in a closet I never use.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:12 pm
 


Yeah, his Punisher stories define the word "awesome". I'm still amazed that the more "mature" Marvel of the 2000's and up to today allowed him to do them. He made Frank Castle into a real human being, and therefore much more legitimately terrifying, taking him light-years away from the one-note character he was previously. I actually got Bart hooked on Ennis's Punisher, with the stories detailing Frank's transition back during his time in the Vietnam war. I'll send you the links from a free online site in a few PM's later on for the better stories.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:23 pm
 


I'm collecting exclusively DC these days. My favorite is currently Flash because I have loved the character and the lore since I read my Mom's comics from the sixties; Josh Williamson's run as been stellar so far and building on the foundations of earlier writers like Geoff Johns and Mark Waid. The current volume of Hawkman is also a treat if you ignore the continuity snarls, particularly the first year that is more Indiana Jones than superheroics with an adventure that spans Ancient Egypt to Thanagae to even Krypton (!).

I can almost hear Thanos yell...


DrCaleb wrote:
I still have them though. They take all that room in a closet I never use.

I still have a couple longboxes in my parents' garage, which house over 2000 comics. Yikes! 8O


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:44 pm
 


Ed Brubaker's Criminal series at Image is pretty damn good. No BS in that one, just crappy scummy people being their natural rotten selves.

PS - I'm a nerd too which gives me all the right I need to needle the other nerds about being, well, nerds. Essentially the exact same thing as the black folk being the only ones allowed to use the n-word on each other. :mrgreen:


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:32 pm
 


DrCaleb wrote:
They occasionally get ones that don't suck. But for every Aquaman, there is a Green Lantern.


Aquaman was awesome! I have also enjoyed Suicide Squad among others. I don't understand why there is so much hate with Green Lantern. I thought the movie was quite good. Green Lantern is my favourite superhero, and I've been reading (and owning) the comics since I was a kid. The movie almost stayed true to the 80's run of the Green Lantern comic, the exception being that the villain Parallax (who is actually Hal Jordan gone mental) into an energy cloud.

Other than that, the movie was great.

DrCaleb wrote:
And did you see the TV crossover "Crisis on Infinite Earths"? Wow, did that blow chunks.


I stopped watching Arrow after season 5, and The Flash after season 3. Got tired of the writers refusing to make any of the main characters happy for a period of time, as well as the half baked way they started to introduce/use other DC characters.

As a comic purist, I can only take so much.

-J.


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:00 pm
 


It appears that some Birds of Prey fans are attempting to torpedo the upcoming Sonic the Hedgehog movie with allegations of homophobia and racism

We know how this worked out, right? The "Woke" crowd tried to do it to Joker and grossed a billion, so I would like nothing more to see them rage against the Blue Blur.

And taking their kids to an ultra-violent, nihilistic, and R-RATED film? Real parent of the year material there, folks. If it really happened (I doubt it.)


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:20 pm
 


If they get that mad at Sonic then their heads would explode if a Leisure Suit Larry movie ever got made. :lol:


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2020 7:06 am
 


CDN_PATRIOT wrote:
Aquaman was awesome! I have also enjoyed Suicide Squad among others. I don't understand why there is so much hate with Green Lantern. I thought the movie was quite good. Green Lantern is my favourite superhero, and I've been reading (and owning) the comics since I was a kid. The movie almost stayed true to the 80's run of the Green Lantern comic, the exception being that the villain Parallax (who is actually Hal Jordan gone mental) into an energy cloud.

Other than that, the movie was great.


I didn't hate Green Lantern. Then again, I didn't love it either. But for Marvel to get to "End Game", I think I counted 16 movies that you had to watch to get the whole background. DC just doesn't have that kind of long term vision, otherwise Green Lantern would have been in Justice League. And who was that twerp playing Flash? ;)


CDN_PATRIOT wrote:
I stopped watching Arrow after season 5, and The Flash after season 3. Got tired of the writers refusing to make any of the main characters happy for a period of time, as well as the half baked way they started to introduce/use other DC characters.

As a comic purist, I can only take so much.

-J.


For me, it's like a car crash. I just have to watch to see the final mangled wreck burst into flames. At least they ended Arrow after 'Crisis'. It was time. Well, it was time in 2018, but now is good too. And who the F-- is "Black Lightning"? Did they invent a character so the line up wouldn't be all white guys?


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