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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 10:51 am
 


saga wrote:
I agree with you. but she's drunk the Kool-Aid so there's no trying to explain reason to her. But they are nat a 'nation, never were a nation and therefore can be either Canadians or Stateless people. Perhaps Valdimir Puting will be more understanding of thier whining and bitching when and if they move thier sorry asses back

They were nations for centuries before Europeans arrived. The Haudenosaunee were self governing until 1924 when the Indian Act dissolved the centuries old Confederacy, outlawing both their participatory democracy and their RELIGION. Again the nasty task of implementing this illegal policy fell to the police - RCMP in this case ... at gunpoint. Practice of traditional spirituality was ILLEGAL and was punished harshly in the residential schools.
They are simply resuming their previous status.

Hyperion, if you or others can propose a reasonable solution, I'm listening. However, shooting them or sending them to Russia just doesn't have any merit. Knee-jerk racist solutions just don't have any merit. Thought, respect and honourable approaches are required if we are to live in peace. I don't think there are many Canadians who would support an approach that meant ongoing strife, violence and disruption.

Of all of the people, including politicians, who have ranted against the occupation of Douglas Creek Estates, NOT ONE has suggested any realistic solution. Violent oppression of their rights was our approach in the past, but it just isn't reasonable any more, and it isn't right.



Indians were are not a nation and never were, and as i said before i dont care how long you were here. Indians during that period of time had no written codex of laws that gauranteed people civil rights, can estblish that they had clearly defined borders with accurate maps, census polls, any type of permenant cities.

Ergo without written documentation that dates from that period that is irrefutable, ie being books and the archives of these 'so-called' nations. there were no nations. And in fact were little more than roving nomads withi no permenance.

And again even though they were roving nomads they still took time out to kill each other and enslave each other with abandon. Something idians would rather not remember

My solution is quite reasonable, assimilate in Canadian culture, accept and obey the laws of this land without hesistaion and be loyal to this country. Or emmigrate back to russia. You want peace, then tell the indians at Caledonia who like to assault retired people and try to kill poice officers to take down the barricades, stop burning tires , and grow up


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:02 am
 


Canada is not alone in having to deal with historical aboriginal agreements. The Australian court has recently acknowledge aboriginal title to the city of Perth Australia.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:04 am
 


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Indians were are not a nation and never were, and as i said before i dont care how long you were here. Indians during that period of time had no written codex of laws that gauranteed people civil rights, can estblish that they had clearly defined borders with accurate maps, census polls, any type of permenant cities.



Very true.


Now the Incas on the other hand...

And the Aztecs...

And the Mayans...


They had power, borders, laws, and very large permanent stone cities.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:05 am
 


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Canada is not alone in having to deal with historical aboriginal agreements. The Australian court has recently acknowledge aboriginal title to the city of Perth Australia.



That still won't stop the Australians fromc alling the natives "Abos"...


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:07 am
 


They have their own law, their own passports, their own justice system.

Hyperion, you are just speaking crap. You know nothing. Pay attention to what happens in the negotiations. That will give you a clue about our legal obligations.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:09 am
 


Forced assimilation is genocide.
They have legal rights that you obviously are not aware of.
Do your homework.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:18 am
 


The stuff you are talking about, Hyperion, is all a matter for negotiation and historical research, well beyond your capabilities and mine. Those are decisions for the government to make.

Indigenous people were here in Ontario for 12,000 years. They had a highly evolved civilization. We are just a 500 year blip in their long history, a blip that they refer to as the 'holocaust' when 99% of them died.

Most Canadians look forward to a peaceful end to Canad's vendetta against them, and it can only end peacefully if we honour our agreements. The government knows that.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:19 am
 


Quote:
They have their own law, their own passports, their own justice system.

Hyperion, you are just speaking crap. You know nothing. Pay attention to what happens in the negotiations. That will give you a clue about our legal obligations.


And you dont listen to me either.

As for indians they're allowed to speak crap, a Canadian right garaunteeed them(unless your not a Canadian which makes that point moot). But as they are not Canadians, as you say, and they were not and are not a nation, then it seems perfectly logical that they rturn to thier own country. Russia

As for the negotiations, , indians in this country are due for a real wake-up call. Stephen Harper has already said no to Kelowna, and will do more. now you can vote for whoever you want (that is unless you insist on not being Canadians - in which case that option is out for you) But the public in this country has grown weary of people who collain and bith about their lives being so bad, when they know very well indians could be just as succesful as anyone else if the took advantage of the same opportunties that all Canadians have ( that is unless you not a Canadian)

If you dont want to be a Canadian, good for you, There's plenty of room in Kamchatka these days i hear - bit cold though


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:22 am
 


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The stuff you are talking about, Hyperion, is all a matter for negotiation and historical research, well beyond your capabilities and mine. Those are decisions for the government to make.

Indigenous people were here in Ontario for 12,000 years. They had a highly evolved civilization. We are just a 500 year blip in their long history, a blip that they refer to as the 'holocaust' when 99% of them died.

Most Canadians look forward to a peaceful end to Canad's vendetta against them, and it can only end peacefully if we honour our agreements. The government knows that.


And as i said , i dont care how long indians were here for, they never had any civilized nations and dont now. Most Canadians are tired of Indians trying to kill cops and assaulting retired people..

Indians cant get that through thier heads its no wonder why Canadians are fed up


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:27 am
 


Quote:
Forced assimilation is genocide.
They have legal rights that you obviously are not aware of.
Do your homework.


No one is forcing you, you have the choice of either stop being your own worst problem, go out and get a marketable education, enter the workforce and make your own lives better enjoy the rights and responsibilites that Canadians accept (But i forgot , indians are Canadians are they). Or emmigrate back to Kamtchatka

Seems fair to me, good enough that people actually want to immigrate to Canada - become proud Canadians and improve thier lives, rather than bitch and moan about how crappy theyve made thier own lives and ask for free handouts


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:31 am
 


Hyperion, I already responded to your exaggerated accusations about the racist old farts who drove IN to the DCE and tried to hit two men with their car, and the injured police officer, one of several blatantly doing surveillance in front of DCE and when challenged, trying to escape via sixth line (duh). The officer was not even touched. The charge has been reduced.

I am not defending these offenders, nor did the Haudenosaunee Confederacy in their press release condemning their actions. It is a matter for the courts now. (and see above for more information).

The real issue is ... why did it become a violent engagement in the first place?
The answer to that lies with an unscrupulous judge protecting his own interests (land) and doing the bidding of two unscrupulous developers who were trying to hide their own illegal acts.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:38 am
 


Assimilation is simply not something that can be imposed on them. Many did 'assimilate' apparently, but only to avoid sending their children to the ools. Now that traditional governance is reemerging, many of them are also returning to traditional ways.

I think you are missing the point: They are the landowners, we are the tenants, and we haven't paid the rent in two hyndred years and we've robbed the resources. It is simply time to pay up ... or go to war with them.

You won't get much support among Canadians for going to war in our own country.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:40 am
 


Quote:
Hyperion, I already responded to your exaggerated accusations about the racist old farts who drove IN to the DCE .


The real issue is ... why did it become a violent engagement in the first place?

The answer to that lies with an unscrupulous judge protecting his own interests (land) and doing the bidding of two unscrupulous developers who were trying to hide their own illegal acts.


You responded with nothing other than indian 'press realeses'. I gave everyone here links to the actual news story. Which you of course flipped out on

Umm it became violent when they assaulted the retired couple and tried to kill a cop

It was the developes property, they owned it, they - unlike the indians protesting has started a buisness and were not only making thier own lives better, they also provided jobs to contruction workers , plumber. electricians painters etc etc

It want thier land and never was since they were not a never were a mation. They indians are however extremely violent


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:40 am
 


Menace ... how nice of you to join us!!

You guys just can't stay away! Here I am in jail, and you come looking for me! How sweet!

You can call them names ... that's your choice ... you didn't need your scalp anyway, right?


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:47 am
 


Usually, when one is in jail, they can't post. So how'd you do it?

Quote:
Menace ... how nice of you to join us!!

You guys just can't stay away! Here I am in jail, and you come looking for me! How sweet!

You can call them names ... that's your choice ... you didn't need your scalp anyway, right?


Someone really needs to put you in the looney bin...


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