[ShepherdsDog]

jeff744 jeff744:

Thanos Thanos:

Spammer! Kill it with fire!

Yeah, he got in a few of them, reported all of them, also, that is freaking awesome, I'd rep you for it if I could.

done, but it was insensitive to First Nations.

[Curtman]

ShepherdsDog ShepherdsDog:

done, but it was insensitive to First Nations.

Lay off the opiates a bit maybe. You're off in your own thread again.

[Curtman]

B.C. municipal leaders vote to decriminalize marijuana

$1:

B.C. municipal leaders voted Wednesday for a resolution that calls for the decriminalization of marijuana, but they’re facing a major hurdle: convincing Prime Minister Stephen Harper’s Conservative government to change the law.

Harper has said previously he’s not interested. But former B.C. attorney-general Geoff Plant urged delegates at the Union of B.C. Municipalities earlier this week to join a “growing chorus of voices” across Canada to show the prime minister that across the country, “people are calling for change.”

While pot decriminalization falls under the purview of the federal government, he said, B.C. municipalities “all govern and live with this disastrous failure of public policy.”

The resolution, put forward by Metchosin District Coun. Moralea Milne, calls for the UBCM to lobby the “appropriate government to decriminalize marijuana and research the regulation and taxation of marijuana.”

It would apply to simple possession of cannabis.

$1:

The resolution suggests that based on current police information, B.C. is responsible for 40 per cent of the marijuana produced in Canada; between 80 and 95 per cent of pot produced in this country is exported illegally into the U.S. and traded for more potent drugs like cocaine or guns; and about 585,000 people in B.C. regularly use the drug.

“This shows that although this is a federal law, it’s municipalities that bear the brunt of paying for those laws,” marijuana activist Dana Larsen said after the vote. “When we’re talking about decriminalization, you want to take the major users off the front lines in the war on drugs.”

If you're in favour of prohibition, you support this. This is what prohibition does for us.

[Curtman]

Decriminalization of pot will disarm gangs

$1:

Over the past few months, the headlines in Victoria speak eloquently to the fact that today's marijuana prohibitions simply do not work, and instead fuel crime.

"Five thousand marijuana plants worth $1 million seized." "Police seize 400 pot plants in Esquimalt." "Saanich police seize guns, drugs; three held." These headlines clearly reflect marijuana's entrenchment in B.C.'s capital and the expansion of the criminal underworld.

At the same time, Victoria police note that gangs from the Lower Mainland are infiltrating the capital city. Earlier this year, a local man with ties to Vancouver-area gangsters was dramatically arrested in Esquimalt beside a Shoppers Drug Mart.

Obviously, the stated intention of prohibition to reduce cannabis supply and suppress demand for marijuana isn't working in Victoria. That's not surprising - it's not working anywhere in B.C. About 5,300 British Columbians were charged in 2010 with cannabis-related offences, and 71 per cent of the province's drug offences in 2010 involved marijuana. Prince George, Nanaimo and Kelowna, in addition to the Lower Mainland, have all witnessed gang violence recently.

As a legal expert and a doctor and researcher, we know that cannabis prohibition causes serious unintended consequences, including massive profits for violent gangs, unregulated and dangerous growops, growing organizedcrime concerns and increasing access to marijuana among youth.

This week, the debate over marijuana policy comes to Victoria during the Union of British Columbia Municipalities convention. Municipal politicians will vote on a series of resolutions, including one stating support for decriminalizing cannabis and researching the taxation and regulation of the drug.

B.C.'s mayors and councillors should back the resolution. Their communities bear the brunt of the unintended harms of marijuana prohibition, so municipalities have a massive stake in fixing the financial and community safety issues surrounding the continuation of the war on drugs.

Earlier this year, a new coalition of legal, law-enforcement and public-health experts known as Stop the Violence B.C. was launched to "break the silence" regarding the failure and negative consequences of cannabis prohibition. Rather than advocate for a free-market approach to legalized marijuana sales that would allow advertisement and promotion of marijuana use, the coalition is calling for a strictly regulated legal market for adult marijuana use under a public health framework.

Research clearly suggests that a regulated model could redirect the hundreds of millions of dollars that currently fuel violence in the illegal market to the provincial government in the form of taxation. More importantly, moving away from a profit-driven and increasingly violent unregulated market to a strictly regulated legal market has the potential to actually reduce rates of marijuana use, in the same way that regulatory tools have dramatically cut rates of tobacco use.

In spite of law-enforcement efforts, we are not protecting young people from the easy availability of marijuana. Although Canada has seen a 70 per cent increase in the number of cannabis-related arrests between 1990 and 2009, the increase in anti-drug law-enforcement expenditures has not made cannabis less available to teenagers and young adults in B.C.

According to the 2009 Canadian Alcohol and Drug Use Monitoring Survey, 27 per cent of B.C.'s youth (aged 15 to 24) used cannabis at least once in the previous year.

The B.C. public gets it. An Angus Reid poll last fall found that 87 per cent of B.C. respondents link gang violence to organized crime's efforts to control the province's massive illegal cannabis trade. A further 69 per cent stated that arresting marijuana producers and sellers is ineffective, and that B.C. would be better off taxing and regulating the use of marijuana.

Although many municipal politicians are playing catch-up to public sentiment, some are leading the call for change. Recently, a coalition of B.C. mayors wrote a letter to provincial political leaders urging them to support the regulation and taxation of cannabis to better protect our communities, reduce crime and undercut gang activity resulting from the illegal marijuana trade. Unfortunately, the province's MLAs and other provincial leaders have remained largely silent on this issue.

Conservative economist Milton Friedman, who won the Nobel Prize in 1976, held strong views about government and marijuana prohibition. He noted: "If you look at the drug war from a purely economic point of view, the role of the government is to protect the drug cartel."

Isn't it time that government got out of the business of protecting markets for drug gangs? Support for the UBCM resolution would send a strong message that the status quo is no longer an option and political action is needed now to overturn prohibition and implement common-sense cannabis laws.

Dr. Evan Wood, a physician, and Geoff Plant, a lawyer and former attorney general of B.C., spoke at a UBCM debate on marijuana policy on Monday at the Victoria Convention Centre.

Guatemala Prez Says Legalize Drugs

$1:

Guatemalan President Otto Perez Molina is advocating the international legalization of drugs even as he is moving to fight narcotics cartels with the biggest military buildup in the Central American country since its long and bloody civil war.

There's no contradiction, the president said in an interview with The Associated Press on Tuesday, a day before he plans to address the U.N. General Assembly.

"We can't take unilateral action, it will be gradual," Perez said, referring to his push for legalization. "Meanwhile, while we're taking these steps, we're not going to let Guatemala become an open corridor for trafficking and consuming drugs."

Perez Molina said he may be the first head of state to propose legalizing drugs before the General Assembly, but the Organization of American States already is studying the idea, with a report due in a year.

"With cocaine and heroin, for example, they're substances that are damaging and addictive," he said. "We would have to regulate the procedures for selling them: a prescription or series of things that would come out of the discussion."

The legalization proposal came just a month after the retired general took office in January with promises of an "iron fist" against crime, and it provoked strong criticism from the United States, as well as intense discussion within Guatemala.

The president said the traditional war on drugs had failed over the past half century, and that the United States' inability to deal with its drug consumption problem left Central America with no option but to promote legalizing drugs in some way.

Meanwhile, to battle Mexican drug cartels that have overrun parts of Guatemala, Perez said he needed military equipment, and put a top priority on ending a longstanding U.S. ban on military aid that was imposed over concerns about human rights abuses during the Central American country's 36-year civil war.

Perez Molina has approved the creation of two new military bases and the upgrading of a third to add as many as 2,500 soldiers. He also signed a treaty allowing a team of 200 U.S. Marines to patrol Guatemala's western coast to catch drug shipments.

He says the measures don't exceed limits imposed on Guatemala's military under the 1996 Peace Accords, which he helped negotiate.

Since the war's end, the military force has fallen by 60 percent, Perez Molina said, and the growth of the civilian police force has not been sufficient to fight the security threat.

"What you saw was an imbalance and parts of the country that were out of control of the state," he said. "Organized crime took advantage of those areas, as well as drug traffickers and criminals and now we're trying to take back that territory."

Mexican drug cartels or their local allies have taken over large swathes of Guatemala and other Central American countries, fueling some of the highest murder rates in the world.

A May 2011 report by the U.S. Congressional Research Service said that 95 percent of all cocaine entering the United States flows through Mexico and its waters, with 60 percent of that cocaine first coming through Central America.

The new Marine operation is the largest in Guatemala since President Jimmy Carter sharply cut U.S. military aid to the country due to concerns over atrocities committed during the country's civil war.

U.S. law says that Guatemala can regain military aid once Secretary of State Hillary Clinton certifies Guatemala's military is "respecting internationally recognized human rights" and cooperating with judicial investigations of former military personnel.

Since Guatemala's civil war ended in 1996, the U.S. has spent $85 million fighting drug traffickers in Guatemala. The level of spending was relatively low, less than $3 million a year, until 2007, when it shot up to $14 million. Last year spending peaked at $16 million, and is budgeted to decline to about $9 million in 2013.

The new operations fall under the Central American Regional Security Initiative, a multinational U.S. effort to fight crime in the region, so officials do not categorize them as direct aid to the Guatemalan military.

"We continue to uphold the military aid ban as well as the Leahy Act which prevents the US from training people suspected of having committed human rights violations," said William Ostick, a spokesman for the State Department's Western Hemispheric Affairs Office.

But he added that "narcotics trafficking is of great concern in the region ... it is clear that interdiction has demonstrable and measurable effects."

Perez said he plans to increase the national police by 10,000, allowing the military to focus on securing the borders and fighting drug trafficking.

Prohibition enables criminals to thrive, and no victory has ever been achieved by the drug war.

[Xort]

Criminals enable other criminals.

I would support listening to the pro pot people if a good majority of them would say, 'I want this to be legal however until it is legal I will not use it.' Then prove it with a drug test.

Until then it's just one criminal saying how their crime isn't a crime, and that the other criminals are the bad ones. While ignoring that the only reason the other 'bad' criminals are around is because of their actions.

[Gunnair]

Xort Xort:

Criminals enable other criminals.

I would support listening to the pro pot people if a good majority of them would say, 'I want this to be legal however until it is legal I will not use it.' Then prove it with a drug test.

Until then it's just one criminal saying how their crime isn't a crime, and that the other criminals are the bad ones. While ignoring that the only reason the other 'bad' criminals are around is because of their actions.

Shhhh....logic and morality will upset Curt.

[Lemmy]

Xort Xort:

Criminals enable other criminals.

I would support listening to the pro pot people if a good majority of them would say, 'I want this to be legal however until it is legal I will not use it.' Then prove it with a drug test.

Until then it's just one criminal saying how their crime isn't a crime, and that the other criminals are the bad ones. While ignoring that the only reason the other 'bad' criminals are around is because of their actions.

It is our DUTY in a free society to refuse to obey unjust laws. Just as non-transit users took up the cause to march with Dr. King against segregated busing in Montgomery, Alabama, you non-pot users are morally required to smoke up in civil disobedience.

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere" -- Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

[Gunnair]

Lemmy Lemmy:

Xort Xort:

Criminals enable other criminals.

I would support listening to the pro pot people if a good majority of them would say, 'I want this to be legal however until it is legal I will not use it.' Then prove it with a drug test.

Until then it's just one criminal saying how their crime isn't a crime, and that the other criminals are the bad ones. While ignoring that the only reason the other 'bad' criminals are around is because of their actions.

It is our DUTY in a free society to refuse to obey unjust laws. Just as non-transit users took up the cause to march with Dr. King against segregated busing in Montgomery, Alabama, you non-pot users are morally required to smoke up in civil disobedience.

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere" -- Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

Can't. Not a Doritos fan...

[ShepherdsDog]

neither is lemmy

[andyt]

I agree with the cop who said it won't really accomplish much until the US legalizes. Most of the pot produced in Canada is shipped to the US and traded for guns and harder drugs. Legalizing here won't do much to affect that business, except maybe act as an example to the US. OTOH, 58,000 Canadians were arrested for pot possession last year. That's a lot of wasted effort and possibly a record for somebody who's doing something no worse than the drinkers. So legalizing and regulating would at least stop that madness.

Unfortunately, if the US does legalize, there goes our drug export income, and we need all the export business we can get to help with our balance of trade. It would take a lot of money out of communities as the drug production business moved closer to the market.

[Curtman]

Lemmy Lemmy:

Xort Xort:

Criminals enable other criminals.

I would support listening to the pro pot people if a good majority of them would say, 'I want this to be legal however until it is legal I will not use it.' Then prove it with a drug test.

Until then it's just one criminal saying how their crime isn't a crime, and that the other criminals are the bad ones. While ignoring that the only reason the other 'bad' criminals are around is because of their actions.

It is our DUTY in a free society to refuse to obey unjust laws. Just as non-transit users took up the cause to march with Dr. King against segregated busing in Montgomery, Alabama, you non-pot users are morally required to smoke up in civil disobedience.

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere" -- Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

I'm not about to snort or shoot up to prove that point though. A relatively harmless thing like pot though? No problem. When people see a group of a few thousand people under a thick blanket of smoke at the legislature, and no harm comes to anybody it helps show how silly the law is.

I'm sure the Xort's of the world would have the Rosa Parks remain at the back of the bus and write their congressman instead, but they'd still be doing it if they hadn't said enough, and used civil disobedience to rock the boat. You have to be prepared to suffer the consequences of that, but with pot there is none. The police won't even arrest you for it. Its that stupid of a law that its not worth their time.

[Gunnair]

Curtman Curtman:

Lemmy Lemmy:

Xort Xort:

Criminals enable other criminals.

I would support listening to the pro pot people if a good majority of them would say, 'I want this to be legal however until it is legal I will not use it.' Then prove it with a drug test.

Until then it's just one criminal saying how their crime isn't a crime, and that the other criminals are the bad ones. While ignoring that the only reason the other 'bad' criminals are around is because of their actions.

It is our DUTY in a free society to refuse to obey unjust laws. Just as non-transit users took up the cause to march with Dr. King against segregated busing in Montgomery, Alabama, you non-pot users are morally required to smoke up in civil disobedience.

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere" -- Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

I'm not about to snort or shoot up to prove that point though. A relatively harmless thing like pot though? No problem. When people see a group of a few thousand people under a thick blanket of smoke at the legislature, and no harm comes to anybody it helps show how silly the law is.

I'm sure the Xort's of the world would have the Rosa Parks remain at the back of the bus and write their congressman instead, but they'd still be doing it if they hadn't said enough, and used civil disobedience to rock the boat. You have to be prepared to suffer the consequences of that, but with pot there is none. The police won't even arrest you for it. Its that stupid of a law that its not worth their time.

Comparing your desire to smoke pot in the same sentence as the civil rights movement.

[OnTheIce]

Lemmy Lemmy:

Xort Xort:

Criminals enable other criminals.

I would support listening to the pro pot people if a good majority of them would say, 'I want this to be legal however until it is legal I will not use it.' Then prove it with a drug test.

Until then it's just one criminal saying how their crime isn't a crime, and that the other criminals are the bad ones. While ignoring that the only reason the other 'bad' criminals are around is because of their actions.

It is our DUTY in a free society to refuse to obey unjust laws. Just as non-transit users took up the cause to march with Dr. King against segregated busing in Montgomery, Alabama, you non-pot users are morally required to smoke up in civil disobedience.

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere" -- Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

Wow, comparing racism to the use of drugs being "unjust". Talk about a stretch....

[Gunnair]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Lemmy Lemmy:

Xort Xort:

Criminals enable other criminals.

I would support listening to the pro pot people if a good majority of them would say, 'I want this to be legal however until it is legal I will not use it.' Then prove it with a drug test.

Until then it's just one criminal saying how their crime isn't a crime, and that the other criminals are the bad ones. While ignoring that the only reason the other 'bad' criminals are around is because of their actions.

It is our DUTY in a free society to refuse to obey unjust laws. Just as non-transit users took up the cause to march with Dr. King against segregated busing in Montgomery, Alabama, you non-pot users are morally required to smoke up in civil disobedience.

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere" -- Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.

Wow, comparing racism to the use of drugs being "unjust". Talk about a stretch....

I think Lemmy wasn't serious. Curt however......

[Curtman]

Gunnair Gunnair:

Comparing your desire to smoke pot in the same sentence as the civil rights movement.

I don't give even half a shit about my "right" to smoke or your right to drink. I care about stopping the violence and the destruction to families caused by the drug war, and waking people up to the fact that the drug war does no good, only harm.

I could go buy as much pot as I wanted right now, and smoke until I fall over. Nobody would stop me. Youve been arguing this for long enough that you must realize that this is a civil rights movement. We have the right to live in a just society and we don't. People get locked up for using and selling drugs while murderers walk free.