[DrCaleb]

martin14 martin14:

desertdude desertdude:

force the little man to comply.

or pay.

But when suggestions that industry needs to put a filter on their emissions and return air and water to the environment in the same condition they took it out; the calls that modern society will be plunged into a new stone age are louder.

[BartSimpson]

desertdude desertdude:

I'll try a different approach to this, a few questions first how long has research been going on GW, have there been any conclusive results, who is the leading authority on the matter, are there vested political or economic interests, and from what little I care to know most predictions haven't even come close to being right. And after having said done and all the best conclusion is that within 100 to 150 years there could be a increase of anywhere from half to a few degrees increase temp, then I'm sorry whether man made or nit, true or false then I just don't give a fart tbh.

Global warming theories have been around since the late 1980's and their advent coincided with the utter failure of the previous bleatings about 'the coming ice age' which had been the scare du jour of the 1970's and early 1980's.

The key predictions of the global warming crowd have been:

1. No more snowfalls in the United Kingdom. This was loudly predicted in 2000 and soundly discredited by 2010.

http://www.independent.co.uk/environmen ... 24017.html

2. Dire rises in sea level to wipe out the Maldive Islands:

http://www.nature.com/ngeo/journal/v2/n ... eo587.html

3. The ongoing trump every year of increased warming absent the presence of observably increased warming.

And etc.

Like in the Arctic this past year there wasn't supposed to be any ice to block the Northwest Passage...yet there was. There's lots of BS excuses as to what happened with the ice but the simple fact is that the prediction was for the Northwest Passage to be ice free and it wasn't. And then the group of assclowns who got stuck in the Antarctic recently...they were there to prove how badly the ice was melting only to experience record amounts of ice blocking their ship...and in the middle of the Antarctic summer.

This is the problem with the 'conclusive results' is that not only haven't there been any, the actual results tend to show no warming at all.

At this rate we'll soon see a team of global warming scientists freeze to death on one of their expeditions. And the survivors will predictably try to BS their way out of the embarrassment.

[BartSimpson]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

But when suggestions that industry needs to put a filter on their emissions and return air and water to the environment in the same condition they took it out; the calls that modern society will be plunged into a new stone age are louder.

Excuse me, but the majority of people anymore support measures to clean up emissions and pollution for their own sake - I'm one of them. What I oppose is magical pseudo scientific arguments that cause bakeries in California to have to shut down because the smell of baking bread is a contributor to global warming.

(AB32 requires bakeries to mitigate all ethanol emissions. Meanwhile the same law mandates that 10% of all fuel used in California be composed of ethanol.)

Idiocy.

[fifeboy]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

But when suggestions that industry needs to put a filter on their emissions and return air and water to the environment in the same condition they took it out; the calls that modern society will be plunged into a new stone age are louder.

Excuse me, but the majority of people anymore support measures to clean up emissions and pollution for their own sake - I'm one of them. What I oppose is magical pseudo scientific arguments that cause bakeries in California to have to shut down because the smell of baking bread is a contributor to global warming.

(AB32 requires bakeries to mitigate all ethanol emissions. Meanwhile the same law mandates that 10% of all fuel used in California be composed of ethanol.)

Idiocy.

The next question then is how do I get the bakery to pay me to bake bread in my fuel tank?

[DrCaleb]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

But when suggestions that industry needs to put a filter on their emissions and return air and water to the environment in the same condition they took it out; the calls that modern society will be plunged into a new stone age are louder.

Excuse me, but the majority of people anymore support measures to clean up emissions and pollution for their own sake - I'm one of them. What I oppose is magical pseudo scientific arguments that cause bakeries in California to have to shut down because the smell of baking bread is a contributor to global warming.

(AB32 requires bakeries to mitigate all ethanol emissions. Meanwhile the same law mandates that 10% of all fuel used in California be composed of ethanol.)

Idiocy.

I agree, mandates without any science behind them is idiocy. All I am suggesting is to treat industrial effluent like the pollution it is. Regardless of global warming and greenhouse gasses, if the air and water industry uses were treated like that, we wouldn't have any problems. Cleaning them up at the source now will be cheaper than trying to clean them up in 100 years. Industry would pay the true cost of manufacturing things, and we avoid offloading those costs onto the future public purse.

Look at things like the Sydney Tar Ponds.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney_Tar_Ponds

Fumes from bitumen heating that make people sick:
http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/hearings-t ... -1.1646276

The recent coal mine berm that broke and spilled into the same river the Fort Chippewan First Nation says is making them sick, and Neil Young raised funds for:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/north/alb ... -1.2428615

This is where many arguments against the oilsands fail, because many new regulations require them to put the land back to nearly the same state they found it in.
http://oilsands.alberta.ca/tailings.html

If we take care of these things now instead of offloading them to our grandchildren, the costs are minuscule in comparison. But every time I suggest it, someone says that it will make manufactured items too expensive. So which do we want; pay now, or offload the costs on the future little guy who we will force to pay for it by our inaction?

[desertdude]

DrCaleb DrCaleb:

martin14 martin14:

desertdude desertdude:

force the little man to comply.

or pay.

But when suggestions that industry needs to put a filter on their emissions and return air and water to the environment in the same condition they took it out; the calls that modern society will be plunged into a new stone age are louder.

I don't hear them, at worst it will make stuff expensive and that kind of expensive I can live with because of direct results and its actually doing good but paying extra to bake some pie in the sky so that alarmists can live a fat lifestyle I wont or I'll join the alarmist crowd with some new scam like selling CO2 free environment friendly unicorn farts which won't drown the poor polar bears.