[grainfedprairieboy]

dougC dougC:

Why don't the conservatives be a little honest here too.

This is all about Harper freaking when he saw Dions' numbers after the leadership convention. There's nothing he wants more than his majority government. It's silly to act like he's attacking Dion as some sort of public service campaign. It's pure ambition on his part and his actions have lowered the level of discussion in our Parliment to where the issues don't matter anymore. Things were bad enough already, this makes them much worse.

I'd say that even more than Chretien, Harper is driven by personal interest.

You think this is about Harper being afraid of Dion and the fact that the Air India inquiry died when the libs voted down the bill had nothing at all to do with it ?

[dougC]

grainfedprairieboy grainfedprairieboy:

dougC dougC:

Why don't the conservatives be a little honest here too.

This is all about Harper freaking when he saw Dions' numbers after the leadership convention. There's nothing he wants more than his majority government. It's silly to act like he's attacking Dion as some sort of public service campaign. It's pure ambition on his part and his actions have lowered the level of discussion in our Parliment to where the issues don't matter anymore. Things were bad enough already, this makes them much worse.

I'd say that even more than Chretien, Harper is driven by personal interest.

You think this is about Harper being afraid of Dion and the fact that the Air India inquiry died when the libs voted down the bill had nothing at all to do with it ?

I don't know about his being afraid, just very concerned about getting behind in the polls and not being able to make it up before the next election. Until just recently the two parties were very close. I don't think the issues really matter to the man, just the results.

Personally I think he over-reacted, I guess we'll see what other Canadians think come voting day.

[Delwin]

grainfedprairieboy grainfedprairieboy:

Delwin: Your blind loyalty to the party on this point is something you may wish to reflect upon. I strongly suppot much of what the conservatives do but certainly not all. The Liberals were very very bad in supporting a terrorist party that was identified to them by CSIS. Even the party wants to bury this so why do you think you can defend them? They cocked up now move on.

Your are confusing my defence as Liberal support, it is not. I have friends who are Tamil, and as with many suppressed groups, we only ever hear one side of the story.

I believe that the Tamils in Sri Lanka should have the right to self determination and that the British messed up when they created one country.

They are not the only ones on their island guilty of attrocities

Of course without the means to defend themselves, their methods are labelled as terrorist, much like the Palistinians.

[grainfedprairieboy]

The liberals did the same thing to Manning, Day and Harper since villifying your opponent just makes good political sense, that you hold the integrity of the Conservatives to a higher esteem is noble but unfair. Dion is probably a nice guy but he is definately not the stuff of leadership needed by a great nation like Canada and even liberals and their friends in the media seem to understand this too. Lets face it, he'd be a better leader for Belgium or Finland or even a provincial premier but do you really want Dion at the helm when some islamofascists topple the CN tower onto downtown Toronto or cause a meltdown at the Pickering nuke plant? Dion is like the 98lbs female fireman whose never going to haul your 225lbs frame to safety.

There are some great potential leaders of Canada in the Liberal ranks but Dion is just not one of them.

[grainfedprairieboy]

Delwin Delwin:

Your are confusing my defence as Liberal support, it is not. I have friends who are Tamil, and as with many suppressed groups, we only ever hear one side of the story.

I believe that the Tamils in Sri Lanka should have the right to self determination and that the British messed up when they created one country.

They are not the only ones on their island guilty of attrocities

Of course without the means to defend themselves, their methods are labelled as terrorist, much like the Palistinians.

Fair enough. But if our foreign intelligence service advises the PM and the party against supporting a group as they may be a potential threat to Canada you have to believe that there is only one side to the story and that is: what is in the best interest of Canada? They ignored analysed intelligence and risked the security of Canada plain and simple. Whether they risked it to gain votes as most believe or out of compassion and greater understanding of the situation then CSIS as you imply is secondary.

Now you may want to debate the decision by CSIS but they operate at a much higher level then we or politicians do and are privy too much more information to churn through the old int cycle in order to come to their conclusions.

[dougC]

grainfedprairieboy grainfedprairieboy:

The liberals did the same thing to Manning, Day and Harper since villifying your opponent just makes good political sense, that you hold the integrity of the Conservatives to a higher esteem is noble but unfair. Dion is probably a nice guy but he is definately not the stuff of leadership needed by a great nation like Canada and even liberals and their friends in the media seem to understand this too. Lets face it, he'd be a better leader for Belgium or Finland or even a provincial premier but do you really want Dion at the helm when some islamofascists topple the CN tower onto downtown Toronto or cause a meltdown at the Pickering nuke plant? Dion is like the 98lbs female fireman whose never going to haul your 225lbs frame to safety.

There are some great potential leaders of Canada in the Liberal ranks but Dion is just not one of them.

The fact we still have a nation is due to the efforts of the Liberals, something that convieniently gets left out of most discussion of their time in power. 51% non, 49% oui was very close to end of this country. It was the last conservative government that left such deep division in the country as to almost destroy it. Dion comes from the party that traditionally holds this nation together, that's why I suport him.

[grainfedprairieboy]

dougC dougC:

The fact we still have a nation is due to the efforts of the Liberals, something that convieniently gets left out of most discussion of their time in power. 51% non, 49% oui was very close to end of this country. It was the last conservative government that left such deep division in the country as to almost destroy it. Dion comes from the party that traditionally holds this nation together, that's why I suport him.

OK, this is just too easy. Has it occurred to you that the only reason it came so close was because of the liberals? In other words had they not been in power there may even not have been a referendum?

I offer as proof Alberta, NFLD and Quebec all polling and ranting heavily about separation but as soon as Harper took office their movements all had the life sucked out of them. I'm sorry dougC but the reality is that the Liberals empower separatist movements through centralisation and consolidation of powers in Ottawa. If you really want to stand up for Canadian unity you'll have to seriously rethink the Liberal Party andgle.

BTW, are you aware most Alberta separatists vote Liberal?

[dougC]

grainfedprairieboy grainfedprairieboy:

dougC dougC:

The fact we still have a nation is due to the efforts of the Liberals, something that convieniently gets left out of most discussion of their time in power. 51% non, 49% oui was very close to end of this country. It was the last conservative government that left such deep division in the country as to almost destroy it. Dion comes from the party that traditionally holds this nation together, that's why I suport him.

OK, this is just too easy. Has it occurred to you that the only reason it came so close was because of the liberals? In other words had they not been in power there may even not have been a referendum?

I offer as proof Alberta, NFLD and Quebec all polling and ranting heavily about separation but as soon as Harper took office their movements all had the life sucked out of them. I'm sorry dougC but the reality is that the Liberals empower separatist movements through centralisation and consolidation of powers in Ottawa. If you really want to stand up for Canadian unity you'll have to seriously rethink the Liberal Party andgle.

BTW, are you aware most Alberta separatists vote Liberal?

It was the conservative policies that lead to the crisis, the Liberals were left with mess.

I remember listening to a conversation my mom had with a Republican lobbyist friend from D.C. in 1988. In his opinion Canada was going to break apart and most parts join with the U.S. within ten years due to conservative policies. I thought he was nuts until 1995 rolled around. And who was behind most of the seperatist movements, not many former Liberals went Reform. Which government was Bouchard a cabinet minister in anyway. The people of Canada made it clear how they felt about the PCs in 1993 and it wasn't because of the great job they'd done for Canada.

There was a soveirgnty crisis that dominated this country in 1990s and it wasn't of Liberal makings. They held the nation together because there was no one else to do it.

[icekarma2752]

grainfedprairieboy grainfedprairieboy:

neopundit neopundit:

stupid conservatives

That's an oxymoron. By definition, if a Conservative is "stupid" then he/she must be a Liberal.

stupid conservatives you say..well how about "intelligent" liberals such as wanker extraodinaire paul martin who totally reaked of thorough incompentance when he came up with his "brilliant" plan to control crime by an all out ban on handguns...getting on the case of decent law-abiding citizens instead of increasing penalities for firearm related crimes? if the liberals had enough brains to pour piss out of a boot even with the instructions written on the sole they'd realize bill c-68 did nothing but redistribute firearms and a lot of them illegally..in fact my uncle didnt want to jump through all the hoops so he just gave me his ww2 303 enfield..and if the liberals did win and banned all handguns i wouldve got a 32 browning auto and a 38 special and the owners(fellow gun collectors) would just claim they were stolen before they'd let the liberal steal them..harpers going to kick the crap out of dion(why the hell doesnt he run for president of france)..dion has nothing whatsoever going for him at all

[icekarma2752]

grainfedprairieboy grainfedprairieboy:

The liberals did the same thing to Manning, Day and Harper since villifying your opponent just makes good political sense, that you hold the integrity of the Conservatives to a higher esteem is noble but unfair. Dion is probably a nice guy but he is definately not the stuff of leadership needed by a great nation like Canada and even liberals and their friends in the media seem to understand this too. Lets face it, he'd be a better leader for Belgium or Finland or even a provincial premier but do you really want Dion at the helm when some islamofascists topple the CN tower onto downtown Toronto or cause a meltdown at the Pickering nuke plant? Dion is like the 98lbs female fireman whose never going to haul your 225lbs frame to safety.

There are some great potential leaders of Canada in the Liberal ranks but Dion is just not one of them.

youre absolutely right on that score..the liberals had a real winner at one time(john turner)

[Bodah]

dougC dougC:

There was a soveirgnty crisis that dominated this country in 1990s and it wasn't of Liberal makings. They held the nation together because there was no one else to do it.

Oh please, Ask Elvis or Numure if it matters what party is in power and how we treat them when it comes to their will for Quebec to become sovereign nation. It doesnt matter the will has been there since 1759.

And if your referring to western alienation, well that's a Liberal made bi-product of your centralized governing policy of Quebec and Ontario comes first and the rest of the country can go to hell. That's why Dion isn't doing to well because he wasn't the best candidate for the job but until you lose the criteria that your leaders have to be from the belle province well your just leading the way for a Conservative majority eventually.

Yeah liberals are really good at holding to country together alright with Sponsorship programs. That really went over well didn't it. Every Quebecer at the time was ready to vote for the PQ, myself included almost just to teach you a lesson.

Good job there at holding the country together.

[dougC]

Bodah Bodah:

dougC dougC:

There was a soveirgnty crisis that dominated this country in 1990s and it wasn't of Liberal makings. They held the nation together because there was no one else to do it.

Oh please, Ask Elvis or Numure if it matters what party is in power and how we treat them when it comes to their will for Quebec to become sovereign nation. It doesnt matter the will has been there since 1759.

And if your referring to western alienation, well that's a Liberal made bi-product of your centralized governing policy of Quebec and Ontario comes first and the rest of the country can go to hell. That's why Dion isn't doing to well because he wasn't the best candidate for the job but until you lose the criteria that your leaders have to be from the belle province well your just leading the way for a Conservative majority eventually.

Yeah liberals are really good at holding to country together alright with Sponsorship programs. That really went over well didn't it. Every Quebecer at the time was ready to vote for the PQ, myself included almost just to teach you a lesson.

Good job there at holding the country together.

Dion was doing fine till the conservative media blitz began.

The Liberals didn't create the political structure of this country alone, they've just done the best job in holding it together. I stand by my statement the Liberals are the only reason we still have a Canada to debate politics over.

Sponsorship was the other side of the struggle for support in Quebec, we hear very little about the public funds spent by the PQ in getting their agenda across.

I agree, it was a great job of holding the country together. The Liberals were left facing an opposition in 1993 that's single goal was the breaking apart of the country. This was the result of nine years of conservatives in power. We're still here to talk about it, Good Job Liberals!

[OnTheIce]

dougC dougC:

Dion was doing fine till the conservative media blitz began.

The Liberals didn't create the political structure of this country alone, they've just done the best job in holding it together. I stand by my statement the Liberals are the only reason we still have a Canada to debate politics over.

Sponsorship was the other side of the struggle for support in Quebec, we hear very little about the public funds spent by the PQ in getting their agenda across.

I agree, it was a great job of holding the country together. The Liberals were left facing an opposition in 1993 that's single goal was the breaking apart of the country. This was the result of nine years of conservatives in power. We're still here to talk about it, Good Job Liberals!

The Liberals numbers started to fall after Dion was nominated. They got worse once the ads went to air.

In case you are unaware, without Quebec, there'd still be a Canada....and a better, more united Country at that. And if they did such a bang up job, why are we still talking about seperation today?

[dougC]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

dougC dougC:

Dion was doing fine till the conservative media blitz began.

The Liberals didn't create the political structure of this country alone, they've just done the best job in holding it together. I stand by my statement the Liberals are the only reason we still have a Canada to debate politics over.

Sponsorship was the other side of the struggle for support in Quebec, we hear very little about the public funds spent by the PQ in getting their agenda across.

I agree, it was a great job of holding the country together. The Liberals were left facing an opposition in 1993 that's single goal was the breaking apart of the country. This was the result of nine years of conservatives in power. We're still here to talk about it, Good Job Liberals!

The Liberals numbers started to fall after Dion was nominated. They got worse once the ads went to air.

In case you are unaware, without Quebec, there'd still be a Canada....and a better, more united Country at that. And if they did such a bang up job, why are we still talking about seperation today?

Any Liberal leader was going to get hit hard after the leadership convention, the fact Harper came out swinging the way he has shows the threat he sees Dion to be.

Canadian unity is a balancing act that wouldn't survive the removal of Quebec. And there's only one party that has shown they have the will and ability to manage it. The conservatives under Mulroney were far to concerned with influences from south of the border and Harper is no different. If anything he's more focused on making Canada more like the states. We've already been down that road and know where it leads. Sovereignty crisis.

[OnTheIce]

dougC dougC:

Any Liberal leader was going to get hit hard after the leadership convention, the fact Harper came out swinging the way he has shows the threat he sees Dion to be.

Canadian unity is a balancing act that wouldn't survive the removal of Quebec. And there's only one party that has shown they have the will and ability to manage it. The conservatives under Mulroney were far to concerned with influences from south of the border and Harper is no different. If anything he's more focused on making Canada more like the states. We've already been down that road and know where it leads. Sovereignty crisis.

I think the CPC saw Dion as a minor threat, easily toppled by advertisements. They worked to a charm. Dion's an easy target.

What's with the anti-American attitude from you Liberals? Canada MUST work with the United States. PEROID. Because Harper works to imrove relations with the USA doesn't mean he's trying to make Canada like the USA, he's trying to make the economy more sustainable. Whether we as Canadians like it or not, we have to kiss the ass of the USA. They are what keeps the economy of this country going and will be there in a heart beat to protect our country, whos military was slashed by your Liberals.

I'm intersted to know how you think Harper's trying to make Canada more like the USA.