[Winnipegger]

Some notable dates for Newfoundland

1497: John Cabot discovers Newfoundland
1498: first Portuguese fishermen establish fishing camps and build a harbour at St. Johns
1501: first permanent (year round) homes built by English fishermen. Abandoned some years later.
1527: John Rut visited St. John's, found Norman, Breton and Portuguese ships in the harbour. On August 3, 1527, Rut wrote a letter to King Henry on the findings of his voyage to North America; this was the first known letter sent from North America.
1534: Jacques Cartier arrived in Newfoundland. He found Breton, Norman and Basque fishermen had been fishing there for over thirty years.
June 11, 1578: Sir Gilbert Humphrey was granted letters patent to establish an English colony in North America
August 3, 1583: Sir Gilbert Humphrey arrived in St. John's English, Jersey Island and Portuguese fishermen.
August 5, 1583: Sir Gilbert Humphrey stands in the town square and claims formal possession of Newfoundland for England, locals ignore him.
Later in 1583: while returning home Sir Gilbert Humphrey's ship sinks in the North Atlantic
1595: a family named Dawe maintained a Fish Plantation near or about Hibb's Cove (formerly Hibb's Hole) in Conception Bay
1602: Sheila Ne Geira and her husband Gilbert Pike settled Bristol's Hope
circa 1600-1620: "Pirate Admiral" Peter Easton plied Newfoundland waters
1608: John Guy visited Newfoundland as a member of the North Virginia Company
May 1610: the English Privy Council granted a charter to the company giving them the whole island. Guy was appointed Governor

http://www.infonet.st-johns.nf.ca/green/avalon.html
http://www.heritage.nf.ca/exploration/f_presence.html

I'm trying to find a Newfoundland history website from a few years ago. It had an in-depth history, including the fact that summer fishing camps were established in 1498 and the first year-round homes built in 1501. I'm sure government types would like to think the only "real" settlements were government sponsored ones, but the truth is fishermen established the permanent settlement of St. Johns all on their own without any government involvement. Government types tried to claim authority over it decades later.

St. John's:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._John's,_Newfoundland_and_Labrador
Tradition declares that the city earned its name when explorer John Cabot became the first European to sail into the harbour, on June 24, 1497 — the feast day of Saint John the Baptist. However, the exact locations of Cabot's landfalls are disputed.
The earliest record of the location appears as São João on a Portuguese map by Jorge Reinel in 1519.
St. Jehan is shown on Nicholas Desliens' world map of 1541 and San Joham is found in João Freire's Atlas of 1546. It was during this time that Water Street was first developed, making it the oldest street in North America.

[Winnipegger]

Interesting lessons! Vikings attempted to take land and establish a settlement by military force. After evaluating the strength of natives in North America, Vikings felt they couldn't conquer so went home. Military conquest didn't work.

Government expiditions sent explorers, Christopher Columbus in 1492, John Cabot 1497, Jacques Cartier 1534, etc., but all only made reports and maps, no settlement.

Government tried to take over commercially built settlements in 1534 and 1578/1583, but failed. Government built sponsored settlements at Roanoke and Jamestown, but both failed. According to the Wikipedia article on Jamestown

$1:

Jamestown followed no fewer than eighteen earlier failed attempts at European colonization of North America, including the famous "Lost Colony" at Roanoke Island in what is now Dare County, North Carolina, and the ill-fated Spanish Ajacan Mission, established thirty-six years earlier by Jesuit priests less than fifteen miles from Jamestown, Virginia. The only successful settlement that preceded Jamestown was the Spanish settlement St. Augustine, Florida, established in 1565.

Ah hem! St. John's was established somewhere between 1498 and 1534 and still stands today. But the point is the long series of failed government sponsored settlements.

St. John's was the first European settlement in North America after the Vikings, and it was just a bunch of fishermen out to make a profit. Private businessmen there for money; not glory, not military, and not government sponsored, just money.

[fire_i]

Interesting - so the fishermen stood in Saint John's for all their life after leaving Europe? If so I guess we can't deny that fits one definition of city/settlement, and I guess that's a point to SJ.

[Rawb]

The Oldest incorporated City in Canada is Saint John New Brunswick Key word Incorcopated(Newfoundland did NOT join Canada until 1949 )Quebec ? What part of the world have they decided to be a part of. Is there still a province called Quebec ?

[CDN_PATRIOT]

From everything I've read and learned on the subject, including some historical books from the library and even finding my Canadian History notes from high school (many, many moons ago), St. Johns NFLD is Canada's oldest city.

Canada's oldest incorporated city is Saint John, NB. In other words, it sucks to be Quebec City. Sorry mon frere.

-J.

[raydan]

and I say...
Does it really matter?
Who cares?
Why bother trying to figure this out?

[Rawb]

POINT is NFLD wasnt part of Canada until 1949 .The oldest city in Canada was Saint John New Brunswick and all of the Provinces were always part of CANADA,Quebec included at that time. That is until present day Quebec is undecided as is the Great Republic of NFLD nice Flag ha ha . Canada should let them go off on their owen and see how long it takes for another country to put them in their place .BON!

[Gunnair]

Holy Necro!

[CDN_PATRIOT]

Rawb Rawb:

POINT is NFLD wasnt part of Canada until 1949 .The oldest city in Canada was Saint John New Brunswick and all of the Provinces were always part of CANADA,Quebec included at that time. That is until present day Quebec is undecided as is the Great Republic of NFLD nice Flag ha ha . Canada should let them go off on their owen and see how long it takes for another country to put them in their place .BON!

St. Johns is older, bub. Both St. John's (1583), Quebec City (1608), and Saint John (1631) were all around BEFORE Confederation in 1867. The POINT is that the oldest city currently in Canada is St. Johns, which precedes the other two.

Capiche?

-J.

[Curtman]

Gunnair Gunnair:

Holy Necro!

Too bad the original article no longer exists.. Looks like a good one.

[Rawb]

CDN_PATRIOT CDN_PATRIOT:

Rawb Rawb:

POINT is NFLD wasnt part of Canada until 1949 .The oldest city in Canada was Saint John New Brunswick and all of the Provinces were always part of CANADA,Quebec included at that time. That is until present day Quebec is undecided as is the Great Republic of NFLD nice Flag ha ha . Canada should let them go off on their owen and see how long it takes for another country to put them in their place .BON!

Capiche?

Ha Ha ok mr Saprano

St. Johns is older, bub. Both St. John's (1583), Quebec City (1608), and Saint John (1631) were all around BEFORE Confederation in 1867. The POINT is that the oldest city currently in Canada is St. Johns, which precedes the other two.

Capiche?

-J.