[wildrosegirl]

saturn_656 saturn_656:

wildrosegirl wildrosegirl:

Is it right for us to continue to build subdivisions, lodges and resorts in these wonderful, tranquil surroundings and continue to execute the animals that we've encroached on because they're a threat to us?

I think not.

Just as elephants are not the gentle giants they seem, humans are far from the superior species we seem to think we are. Mother nature likes to correct us on that one periodically. It might serve a few of us well to sit up and listen, instead of play the martyr and shoot.

While that sounds great in theory, in practice not many people are going to agree with you, particularly people living in rural areas who experience problems with overly aggressive wildlife.

I've lived in rural areas all my life. Bears, deer, moose, coyotes.. all a fact of life. People seem to forget that the wildlife are the trade off to living in the city with the gangs, crackheads, etc. Do we shoot every thief that breaks into our home and threatens our children? Do we have a right to simply shoot someone who has attacked us brutally? Nooooooooo..... that would infringe on human's rights. When do the animals get rights? At what point do we accept responsibility and accept the dangers of encroaching on wildlife habitat, without it costing the animals?

Would I want my children harmed? Hell no. But guess what - I've NEVER even considered calling conservation to put down the moose that used to frequent our front lawn, the mama bear and her two cubs that regularly trekked through my back yard, or the deer that slept on my back deck in the winter. I was in their territory. And truthfully - I feel far safer with that big moose (and yes, they are a threat) in my driveway, than any human. At least with animals, you know what you're potentially dealing with.

[wildrosegirl]

saturn_656 saturn_656:

I wouldn't call what happened to this woman and her child an "accident", it was an attack.

Provoked by?

We don't know. How do you know her calf hadn't been recently threatened and she wasn't still skittish? Happens with humans too. Something terrifies them, they're a bundle of nerves, someone comes up at the wrong moment, and.... attack. On purpose? Not really. They simply react without taking that moment to assess the situation properly. Maybe this elephant is guilty of only that.

Or - maybe other humans had taunted her and she felt threatened by all of them. It happens with domestic animals. Why not wild ones?

[saturn_656]

wildrosegirl wildrosegirl:

I've lived in rural areas all my life. Bears, deer, moose, coyotes.. all a fact of life. People seem to forget that the wildlife are the trade off to living in the city with the gangs, crackheads, etc. Do we shoot every thief that breaks into our home and threatens our children? Do we have a right to simply shoot someone who has attacked us brutally? Nooooooooo..... that would infringe on human's rights. When do the animals get rights? At what point do we accept responsibility and accept the dangers of encroaching on wildlife habitat, without it costing the animals?

Would I want my children harmed? Hell no. But guess what - I've NEVER even considered calling conservation to put down the moose that used to frequent our front lawn, the mama bear and her two cubs that regularly trekked through my back yard, or the deer that slept on my back deck in the winter. I was in their territory. And truthfully - I feel far safer with that big moose (and yes, they are a threat) in my driveway, than any human. At least with animals, you know what you're potentially dealing with.

I never suggested shooting animals simply because they happen to stroll across your lawn. Where I live I also come into contact with moose, deer, coyotes, wolves, and bears. I have yet to call the MNR or the OPP to come and kill anything (aside from the moose I cranked with my car).

But you can be sure that if a wild animal turns hostile I will have no second thoughts about contacting the authorities to destroy it.

[saturn_656]

wildrosegirl wildrosegirl:

saturn_656 saturn_656:

I wouldn't call what happened to this woman and her child an "accident", it was an attack.

Provoked by?

We don't know. How do you know her calf hadn't been recently threatened and she wasn't still skittish? Happens with humans too. Something terrifies them, they're a bundle of nerves, someone comes up at the wrong moment, and.... attack. On purpose? Not really. They simply react without taking that moment to assess the situation properly. Maybe this elephant is guilty of only that.

Or - maybe other humans had taunted her and she felt threatened by all of them. It happens with domestic animals. Why not wild ones?

None of that is particularly relevant, at least as far as public safety is concerned. Had this happened in Canada with say a bear or a cougar that animal would be destroyed.

I've yet to see a natural resources officer or police constable consider the motivations of a dangerous animal before they shoot it. It's a threat to public safety and that is that.

[Mockingbird]

wildrosegirl wildrosegirl:

saturn_656 saturn_656:

wildrosegirl wildrosegirl:

Is it right for us to continue to build subdivisions, lodges and resorts in these wonderful, tranquil surroundings and continue to execute the animals that we've encroached on because they're a threat to us?

I think not.

Just as elephants are not the gentle giants they seem, humans are far from the superior species we seem to think we are. Mother nature likes to correct us on that one periodically. It might serve a few of us well to sit up and listen, instead of play the martyr and shoot.

While that sounds great in theory, in practice not many people are going to agree with you, particularly people living in rural areas who experience problems with overly aggressive wildlife.

I've lived in rural areas all my life. Bears, deer, moose, coyotes.. all a fact of life. People seem to forget that the wildlife are the trade off to living in the city with the gangs, crackheads, etc. Do we shoot every thief that breaks into our home and threatens our children? Do we have a right to simply shoot someone who has attacked us brutally? Nooooooooo..... that would infringe on human's rights. When do the animals get rights? At what point do we accept responsibility and accept the dangers of encroaching on wildlife habitat, without it costing the animals?

Would I want my children harmed? Hell no. But guess what - I've NEVER even considered calling conservation to put down the moose that used to frequent our front lawn, the mama bear and her two cubs that regularly trekked through my back yard, or the deer that slept on my back deck in the winter. I was in their territory. And truthfully - I feel far safer with that big moose (and yes, they are a threat) in my driveway, than any human. At least with animals, you know what you're potentially dealing with.

But would you have called conservation officers had one of these potentially dangerous animals attacked your child? Or would you still have the warm fuzzy you get co-habitating with these animals?

Funny too that while you seem to oppose encroachment you yourself admit you live/d in areas where bears and moose frequent your property. How can you then vilify encroachment when you yourself....encroach?

I think this animal was acting out of instinct, the same instinct that all animals have when it comes to defending their young. I feel fault lies with the resort owners for being unaware of the potential dangers surrounding their resort which led to this unfortunate incident.

[Brenda]

Do, in Canada, resort guides who take their customers on a trek in the wild, carry guns?

[PublicAnimalNo9]

Wow, lots of so-called humans are VERY serious threats to public safety. Too bad the law didn't do the same thing with them.

[Zipperfish]

saturn_656 saturn_656:

Brenda Brenda:

Was it? Cougars are known for their "useless" attacks, so to speak.

Useless attacks?

Elephants are not the gentle giants people seem to think they are. They are known to have fits of unprovoked rage, in India they have leveled entire villages in brutal attacks, gore and trample kids, etc.

This attack on the mother seems excessively brutal. The woman was likely dead or disabled after the first strike, yet the attack persisted.

Fits of unprovoked rage? Brutal goring of kids? Maybe we should just kill them all then. And the snakes. And the tigers.

This summer I was ruthlessly attacked by some poson ivy. Let's nuke the posion ivy!

[Tyler_1]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

saturn_656 saturn_656:

Brenda Brenda:

Was it? Cougars are known for their "useless" attacks, so to speak.

Useless attacks?

Elephants are not the gentle giants people seem to think they are. They are known to have fits of unprovoked rage, in India they have leveled entire villages in brutal attacks, gore and trample kids, etc.

This attack on the mother seems excessively brutal. The woman was likely dead or disabled after the first strike, yet the attack persisted.

Fits of unprovoked rage? Brutal goring of kids? Maybe we should just kill them all then. And the snakes. And the tigers.

This summer I was ruthlessly attacked by some poson ivy. Let's nuke the posion ivy!

Leave the tigers alone

[saturn_656]

Brenda Brenda:

Do, in Canada, resort guides who take their customers on a trek in the wild, carry guns?

Depends what kind of resort. With the kind we have in our area (hunting and fishing) it is not unheard of to carry a firearm.

When we go to camp, usually there is at least one long gun (usually a shotgun) in the group.

[raydan]

DonnaWho DonnaWho:

Leave the tigers alone

I've seen them play football, they're pretty harmless.

[Tyler_1]

raydan raydan:

DonnaWho DonnaWho:

Leave the tigers alone

I've seen them play football, they're pretty harmless.

Well maybe that is why they should be left alone
Next year they will do better

[saturn_656]

Zipperfish Zipperfish:

Fits of unprovoked rage? Brutal goring of kids? Maybe we should just kill them all then. And the snakes. And the tigers.

This summer I was ruthlessly attacked by some poson ivy. Let's nuke the posion ivy!

I never said we should kill them all, just ones threaten human safety. Had someone in that group carried a firearm they may still be alive.

[wildrosegirl]

Mockingbird Mockingbird:

Funny too that while you seem to oppose encroachment you yourself admit you live/d in areas where bears and moose frequent your property. How can you then vilify encroachment when you yourself....encroach?

I oppose people who buy homes on the "lovely, scenic hillside, overlooking the natural lake" and then play the martyr once they realize they have four legged neighbours. I accept that I'm in "their territory", and do not complain when they pop by to check out the new lawn ornaments. I also accept that there's a risk to having them about. When in urban residence, I accept that my human neighbours can be at least as dangerous as any moose could be.

$1:

I think this animal was acting out of instinct, the same instinct that all animals have when it comes to defending their young. I feel fault lies with the resort owners for being unaware of the potential dangers surrounding their resort which led to this unfortunate incident.

I agree on the instinct part. It's undoubtedly what fueled the incident. As far as fault - partially. They did post a sign. What more can they do, really? To predict animal behaviour is like predicting the weather. We all know how well we do at that.

[PublicAnimalNo9]

Gotta wonder how many other morons take their baby hiking in the wild with them