[BRAH]

It doesn't matter what he did or didn't do in Afghanistan, whether if it was combat operations or serving coffee at Tim Horton's because at the end of the day he was there.

[PluggyRug]

There will be the usual shouting match in question period. The Libs will then lift the carpet and everything will be swept under to accompany all the other Liberal bullshit.

[martin14]

Freakinoldguy Freakinoldguy:

But hey, you and the Liberals seem to be okay with lying to make yourself look good. Just look at Kristy Duncan "fake Nobel Laureate" or how about Maryam Monsef, who misrepresented herself when asked where she was born and of course, my favorite Liberal of all time Hedy Fry. All lied with zero consequences.
So, as you can see Harjit is just another in a list of current Liberal liars who when caught shrug it off and carry on as if nothing happened because people like you are willing to let them.

Just Lieberals being Lieberals.

It's what they and their supporters do.

[Coach85]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

Pretty comical coming from a Trump supporter. Funny how you and Martin and the rest don't think Trump needs to resign any of the HUNDREDS of outrageously false lies he's told.

Politicians lie, sometimes shamefully. Sajjans lie was shameful. Did you read that Shep? I'll say it again: SAJJANS LIE WAS SHAMEFUL. One more time for the ultra-dense: SAJJANS LIE WAS SHAMEFUL.

But show me one example of a senior minister having to resign for telling a tall tale about their accomplishments in a public speech. Not a lie under oath, or a lie to conceal impropriety but a lie about their accomplishments. I bet you can't. Not because politicians never lie. And the lie was in a speech to a foreign audience overseas to boot.

You accuse me of defending him because he's liberal. I'm not defending him. But you people are demanding that he resign because he's liberal. I'm sure you would not be saying this if it were a conservative Minister.

And the trend continues.

Another post filled with weak attempts at condemnation yet filled with excuses and defence aimed at the party of your liking.

You original referred to the statement as a mere PR blunder...honest mistake. Now, your tone has changed to "shameful" yet it's continued with attacks on the other posters because they're not on the same political spectrum as you. You are defending him.

When your party or members of are being attacked, you come to their defense with weak insults at other members and references to previous government as justification.

The comment was shameful. Agreed. He shouldn't lose his job as an MP but he should be removed from his current portfolio simply due the the complete lack of respect he has from the people he's supposed to represent.

[BeaverFever]

Coach85 Coach85:

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

Pretty comical coming from a Trump supporter. Funny how you and Martin and the rest don't think Trump needs to resign any of the HUNDREDS of outrageously false lies he's told.

Politicians lie, sometimes shamefully. Sajjans lie was shameful. Did you read that Shep? I'll say it again: SAJJANS LIE WAS SHAMEFUL. One more time for the ultra-dense: SAJJANS LIE WAS SHAMEFUL.

But show me one example of a senior minister having to resign for telling a tall tale about their accomplishments in a public speech. Not a lie under oath, or a lie to conceal impropriety but a lie about their accomplishments. I bet you can't. Not because politicians never lie. And the lie was in a speech to a foreign audience overseas to boot.

You accuse me of defending him because he's liberal. I'm not defending him. But you people are demanding that he resign because he's liberal. I'm sure you would not be saying this if it were a conservative Minister.

And the trend continues.

Another post filled with weak attempts at condemnation yet filled with excuses and defence aimed at the party of your liking.

You original referred to the statement as a mere PR blunder...honest mistake. Now, your tone has changed to "shameful" yet it's continued with attacks on the other posters because they're not on the same political spectrum as you. You are defending him.

When your party or members of are being attacked, you come to their defense with weak insults at other members and references to previous government as justification.

The comment was shameful. Agreed. He shouldn't lose his job as an MP but he should be removed from his current portfolio simply due the the complete lack of respect he has from the people he's supposed to represent.

I didn't say it was an honest mistake I said it was a blunder. "Blunders" are usually deliberate choices that are foolish. For example the Dieppe raid is most commonly described as a military blunder....nobody is suggesting the army raided that town by accident.

He will not be the first or the last politician to get caught on a lie but senior ministers don't resign from their portfolios simply for telling grandiose lies about their past accomplishments. Undoubtedly he has lost the respect of the troops, bur that's true of most Ministers of recent decades.

The wrong done by Sajjan is REAL. I am not defending it. But the conservative response that he resign is the typical over-reaction with out any precedent. I've asked the conservatives here to show me an example of a senior minister resigning over something like this and true to form, as they do in almost every thread, all they can respond with is personal insults against me because you have no facts to support your position.

[Canadian_Mind]

BRAH BRAH:

It doesn't matter what he did or didn't do in Afghanistan, whether if it was combat operations or serving coffee at Tim Horton's because at the end of the day he was there.

It matters to those of us who were over there and didn't lie about the role we had to play.

[peck420]

You are gonna want to do a ton more research.

Canadian politics is, literally, riddled with MP's that have resigned over lying. In fact, lying is the most common cause of an MP's resignation.

We just give it fancier terms, so I will give this one a fancier term for you....fraud.

Here is a link to the list of MP resignations:
http://www.lop.parl.gc.ca/ParlInfo/Compilations/FederalGovernment/MinisterialResignations.aspx

Here is the definition of fraud:

$1:

fraud
frôd/
noun
noun: fraud; plural noun: frauds

wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.
"he was convicted of fraud"
synonyms: fraudulence, cheating, swindling, embezzlement, deceit, deception, double-dealing, chicanery, sharp practice; More
pharming
"he was arrested for fraud"
swindle, racket, deception, trick, cheat, hoax;
informalscam, con, rip-off, sting, gyp, fiddle, bunco, hustle, grift
"social insurance frauds"
a person or thing intended to deceive others, typically by unjustifiably claiming or being credited with accomplishments or qualities.
"mediums exposed as tricksters and frauds"
synonyms: impostor, fake, sham, charlatan, quack, mountebank; More
swindler, gonif, snake oil salesman, fraudster, racketeer, cheat, confidence trickster;
informalphony, con man, con artist, scam artist
"they exposed him as a fraud"

Origin

Add in that he is in charge of an institution that takes words like "honour" and "trust" extremely seriously...he doesn't really have a choice. He needs to resign or be put somewhere else. He has broken the trust, and he is now viewed (by those that he oversees) as without honour, he is ineffective in the position he now holds.

[Matlow]

Can someone explain to me what the difference is between Mr. Sajjan and Brian Williams?

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/brian-williams-suspended-six-months-wake-review-n304086

Other than Mr. Sajjan apparently will face no consequences for his demonstrable lack of integrity.

[BeaverFever]

peck420 peck420:

You are gonna want to do a ton more research.

Canadian politics is, literally, riddled with MP's that have resigned over lying. In fact, lying is the most common cause of an MP's resignation.

We just give it fancier terms, so I will give this one a fancier term for you....fraud.

Here is a link to the list of MP resignations:
http://www.lop.parl.gc.ca/ParlInfo/Compilations/FederalGovernment/MinisterialResignations.aspx

Here is the definition of fraud:

$1:

fraud
frôd/
noun
noun: fraud; plural noun: frauds

wrongful or criminal deception intended to result in financial or personal gain.
"he was convicted of fraud"
synonyms: fraudulence, cheating, swindling, embezzlement, deceit, deception, double-dealing, chicanery, sharp practice; More
pharming
"he was arrested for fraud"
swindle, racket, deception, trick, cheat, hoax;
informalscam, con, rip-off, sting, gyp, fiddle, bunco, hustle, grift
"social insurance frauds"
a person or thing intended to deceive others, typically by unjustifiably claiming or being credited with accomplishments or qualities.
"mediums exposed as tricksters and frauds"
synonyms: impostor, fake, sham, charlatan, quack, mountebank; More
swindler, gonif, snake oil salesman, fraudster, racketeer, cheat, confidence trickster;
informalphony, con man, con artist, scam artist
"they exposed him as a fraud"

Origin

Add in that he is in charge of an institution that takes words like "honour" and "trust" extremely seriously...he doesn't really have a choice. He needs to resign or be put somewhere else. He has broken the trust, and he is now viewed (by those that he oversees) as without honour, he is ineffective in the position he now holds.

LOL.

Well if he gets criminally charged with fraud they you have a case. Those who have resigned over lying were caught lying under oath or lying about serious improprieties, not about about empty boasting of fake accomplishments in a public speech made to foreigners overseas.

Yes he's probably going to have a difficult time earning the respect of the troops. He's not the first nor the last MND who will not be respected by the troops. I don't think Kim Campbell, David Collenette, Art Eggleton, or Bill Graham were loved either. Pretty sure the soldiers are not going to go on strike. Being a professional, especially in the military, means working with and following orders of superiors even when you think they are total assholes.

[BartSimpson]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

It's a terrible blunder but it's not resignation worthy. Resignations of senior cabinet ministers are for scandals, not PR blunders and gaffes.

I don't recall your being so forgiving with any of the Trump people.

[Coach85]

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

I didn't say it was an honest mistake I said it was a blunder. "Blunders" are usually deliberate choices that are foolish. For example the Dieppe raid is most commonly described as a military blunder....nobody is suggesting the army raided that town by accident.

I'm not here to play semantics over your interpretation of the term 'blunder'. The only blunder here was you referring to the situation as a "PR blunder" or "gaffe" only to change your tune a few posts later to condemn the action a little more stronger than you originally claimed you did.

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

The wrong done by Sajjan is REAL. I am not defending it. But the conservative response that he resign is the typical over-reaction with out any precedent. I've asked the conservatives here to show me an example of a senior minister resigning over something like this and true to form, as they do in almost every thread, all they can respond with is personal insults against me because you have no facts to support your position.

Perhaps your right. It was more of a downplay than a defend. Like politicians, you need to choose your words carefully. Especially as it pertains to a comment that has made people quite sensitive.

[BeaverFever]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

BeaverFever BeaverFever:

It's a terrible blunder but it's not resignation worthy. Resignations of senior cabinet ministers are for scandals, not PR blunders and gaffes.

I don't recall your being so forgiving with any of the Trump people.

I haven't called for any of them to resign, have I?

[PluggyRug]

[Freakinoldguy]

Someone said we wouldn't be asking for Mr. Sajjian's resignations if he was a Conservative. Well allow me to point out that, the last Conservative Minister of National Defense who screwed up like this man did had the decency to "RESIGN". Anybody else remember one Mr. Robert C. Coates and his visit to a peeler bar? An infraction I'd consider much less heinous than stealing someone else's valour.

Other people are saying we're holding this person to an unrealistically high standard because he's a Liberal. Well sorry, but once again you're wrong. We're holding him to a completely reasonably high standard because as a former Senior Officer he should have known, understood and accepted the military ethos about honour and valour especially since he's the person making policy for the warriors he expects Canadians to hold to those same standards.

TBH, the only honourable thing for this man to do would be to resign his position in the cabinet and sit as just another Liberal MP. He's disgraced his former profession and his position as MND and if he was still in uniform he'd be facing some very serious charges.

[ShepherdsDog]

Why are you trying to explain things like ethics and honour to beaver? It's like trying to explain shades of blue to someone who was born blind.