[poquas]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

I'm not hiding behind any canard. You are asking someone to explain the actions of someone else. That would be like asking to explain why anyone does anything, or doesn't do anything as the case may be. I'm just being honest because I don't pretend to have all the answers, unlike some evolutionists.
One could just as easily ask why God gives some people gifts? By that I mean an amazing talent in some field that they are born with.
And believe me, after my back was broken, more than once I asked God, "Why me?"
18 years later I have my answer. My life is right where I want it to be. I'm retired, have a beautiful, loving wife whom I love dearly, I'm happy and content, I'm a LOT more patient and understanding than I used to be.
I learned a LOT about myself after the accident and realized, man I had some SERIOUS work to do.
The accident didn't "save" me as I was already a Christian, just separated from the Church for several years at that point. It was more like a wake up call cuz my life was definitely NOT going down the right path.
And just so everyone knows the extent of my Christian beliefs so they can see exactly where I'm coming from, I believe in harmless stuff like Creation, that Jesus died for our sins, that organized religion isn't always or necessarily a good thing, and if there is such a thing as macro-evolution, it better start getting its ass busy improving the species otherwise, at the rate we're going, we're gonna evolutionize ourselves right out of existence.

I can appreciate a lot of what you have said, but it prompts a question. You you need God, or a religion to be a good person or to have things go your way for a change?

[BartSimpson]

poquas poquas:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

The Bible is an historical document.

Wow!

All that and we’ve just gone full circle.

YOUR faith may consider the bible an historical document, however anyone capable of reasoned, objective, rational thinking does not.

Edit: Let me ask, is it your contention that none of the events written of in the Bible actually happened?

[poquas]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

poquas poquas:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

The Bible is an historical document.

Wow!

All that and we’ve just gone full circle.

YOUR faith may consider the bible an historical document, however anyone capable of reasoned, objective, rational thinking does not.

You're so hateful you don't see how you just made a total ass out of yourself.

There's no end of secular scholars who use the Bible as an historical reference.

Excessive defensiveness.

I don't HATE anything. I disagree with any organised religion that removes the ability of free thought. You’re demonstrating that very inability.

What branch of Christianity are you aligned with?

[DerbyX]

2Cdo 2Cdo:

Sorry sunshine, but I'm not particularly religious. I just don't trust pompous hypocrites who reek of the same fanaticism they accuse others of.

Hey. That's one of my registered trademark remarks. In lieu of a fine I'll accept a donation to the ferret relief fund.

[PluggyRug]

There are mosquitoes...therefore God does not exist.

[PublicAnimalNo9]

poquas poquas:

I can appreciate a lot of what you have said, but it prompts a question. You you need God, or a religion to be a good person or to have things go your way for a change?

Well first off, pre-accident, things were going my way, unfortunately those "things" were leading me the wrong way, I just wasn't paying attention.
To directly answer your question, I'd say no, He's not a crutch. My conscience pretty much keeps me on the straight and narrow these days. If your question is about people in general, well the answer is pretty obvious. I have several friends that don't believe in God that are super nice people.
This is how I try and equate one's actions in life. Imagine standing before your mother, completely exposed while you tell her all the nasty, dirty, ugly, sordid things you've done in life. Even though she'll still love you, it's not pleasant to think about having to do that. Well, I got enough to explain to God when I get there(although He already knows) without adding to the total.
But in the end, all I can do is be the best me I can be.
I also believe that people who generally live good, decent lives will gain acceptance into Heaven simply because they at least tried to be good, decent human beings in the same spirit as Jesus Christ. When you consider when John 3:16 was written, it would seem that a good portion of the world at the time would have been condemned to hell, regardless of how decent a human being they were, simply because they never even heard the Word. I don't believe in that god.
This then begs the question, why do we even have a conscience? If we are just an accident of nature, why would we need an internal alarm to tell us what we're doing is wrong? Why are we the only species that instinctively knows what we're doing is wrong, WHILE we do it? Can't blame it on religion, because non-religious peole feel guilt and remorse as well.

[BartSimpson]

poquas poquas:

I don't HATE anything. I disagree with any organised religion that removes the ability of free thought.

What you've been saying here is evidencing a pretty powerful set of emotions. To me it appears to be hatred. I'm not sure what other emotion allows one to completely ignore my secular thoughts and then to focus on a religiosity that I'm not demonstrating.

"The Bible is an historic document" is hardly a religious comment. Yet you choose to see it as such.

poquas poquas:

You’re demonstrating that very inability.

That's right. I'm demonstrating my inflexibility by acknowledging that the Koran and many other religious books also are a source of historical reference. How narrow minded of me not to dismiss them outright just because they're also religious books. Oh, wait...that's you.

poquas poquas:

What branch of Christianity are you aligned with?

What branch of atheism are you aligned with?

[BartSimpson]

PluggyRug PluggyRug:

There are mosquitoes...therefore God does not exist.

Mosquitoes are proof that socialists exist in the firmament of the universe.

They're blood sucking parasites who serve no useful purpose other than to buzz around and irritate the productive individuals they depend on for their very survival.

[Gunnair]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

sandorski sandorski:

Local Floods happen everywhere, so everywhere(not literally though) has a local Flood Myth/Legend in it's past. Not Proof of a Global Flood, just Proof that Floods are a common calamity.

See, once again, things get taken out of context, not just by non-believers but by believers as well. Today, people take it that it was a global flood, which even I seriously doubt. However, it's quite possible, and there is some scientific evidence to support the claim, that a large majority of the KNOWN world could have been flooded at the time.

Exactly. Flood myths are common because of the populations worldwide living near oceans, rivers and lakes that would have been displaced by the rising sea levels and increased galcier meltwater of the post iceage.

[poquas]

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

They're blood sucking parasites who serve no useful purpose other than to buzz around and irritate the productive individuals they depend on for their very survival.

That's exactly how I feel about organized religion, and to answer your earlier question about anything being "real" in the bible, for the 99% that relates directly to a fictitious person named Jesus in the New Testament and to the morality stories and references to a God in the Old Testament, No.

The only factual information in the bible are names of places, and references to people or events that are confirmed to have existed or occurred by other historical references.

[sandorski]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

sandorski sandorski:

Certain parts of the Bible are certainly Historic. The Old Testament is like a "Best of" of Ancient Israeli Literature and Historic records. The Literature ranges from Art to Folklore. The Historic ranges from Events to Family Trees to the Law. People, Religious people mostly, tend to confuse the differences.

Joshua blew Trumpets and the Walls fell? BS. The Walls may have fallen, but the Trumpets were not the cause. Miracles do not happen, end of discussion.

Maybe you should go back and re-read that part before you make comments that show off your incredibly limited comprehension skills.

What did I miss?

[Gunnair]

poquas poquas:

BartSimpson BartSimpson:

poquas poquas:

You're so hateful you don't see how you just made a total ass out of yourself.

There's no end of secular scholars who use the Bible as an historical reference.

Excessive defensiveness.

I don't HATE anything. I disagree with any organised religion that removes the ability of free thought. You’re demonstrating that very inability.

What branch of Christianity are you aligned with?

Funny, for those of faith who have chosen to follow it through free will, why would you wish to deny them their free thought?

[fifeboy]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

And what's even MORE amazing is these chemicals even had the fore-sight to "evolve" into both animal AND plant life. Seems like a pretty "miraculous" transformation to me.

WELL...considering how dumb those chemicals were, could we call this "Unintelligent Design?"

[poquas]

Gunnair Gunnair:

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

sandorski sandorski:

Local Floods happen everywhere, so everywhere(not literally though) has a local Flood Myth/Legend in it's past. Not Proof of a Global Flood, just Proof that Floods are a common calamity.

See, once again, things get taken out of context, not just by non-believers but by believers as well. Today, people take it that it was a global flood, which even I seriously doubt. However, it's quite possible, and there is some scientific evidence to support the claim, that a large majority of the KNOWN world could have been flooded at the time.

Exactly. Flood myths are common because of the populations worldwide living near oceans, rivers and lakes that would have been displaced by the rising sea levels and increased galcier meltwater of the post iceage.

The flood story is connected to the Babylonian/Assyrian myth about Gilgamesh and is believed to be a reference of the pre-historic flood at the Bosphorus . Much like the virgin birth and Jesus is connected to the Egyptian myth of Horus and was co-opted by the break-away sect of Jews to justify the arrival of a messiah.

[BartSimpson]

poquas poquas:

The only factual information in the bible are names of places, and references to people or events that are confirmed to have existed or occurred by other historical references.

So you're saying that the Bible, in addition to being a religious book, is also a historical document whose veracity on selected issues is confirmed as accurate and valid by other contemporary sources?

I've been saying this all along here.