[Abbas]

Tricks,

What I know and have been taught of islam is that we can not make anybody do anything regardless of whether its a man or a woman.

If you seen some nut case muslim shoot another woman because she did something wrong then he will be punished for it, that doesnt mean islam teaches it.

Think about it, if a drunk dude beats up his wife at home, would you say a Christain or Jew did it? Nope. So, Islam says, cover yourself (burka, hijab, dubata) are all part of that and woman choose to do this, they are not forced, not here, nor in MOST muslim countries.

Education is the first thing we have to pay attention to since it will enlighten us about the world it self. Whether it be a woman or man, they are both obligated to educate themselves as much as possible.

A WOMAN, MAN or INBETWEEN can change, not obey or put down their religion, if they wish. No muslim would put a bullet in anybodies head for changing religion and if they do, then they are the enemies of Islam, not friends.

I hope this answers your question, once again tricks, be mature and I Will answer anything you through at me. Thnx

[EyeBrock]

I'm well aware that Islam taken literally, is a religion of peace. Christianity pre 16th Century waged war on any 'non-believers'. It too was supposedly a religion of peace.

The difference is that we stopped going to war in the 16th century for purely religous reasons.

Islam has Suras full of lines espousing equality for women. During the Prophet's time women were the main property holders, as was the Prophet's first wife as I'm sure you will know.

I'm buggered if I can find a Sura that says a women must have 4 male witnesses to prove she was raped, slutty clothes or not.

I'm also at a loss to find a Sura that says a wife must walk three paces behind her man.

Or one that says a female must carry her marriage certificate.

Or one that says she cannot drive a car.

The problem with Islam is that it's true meaning has been corrupted by local customs and traditions, mostly oppressive customs that enslave women, marginalise gays, forbid education of females as the taliban did etc etc.

Your posts are a testament to medieval thinking.

[Abbas]

$1:

A WOMAN, MAN or INBETWEEN can change, not obey or put down their religion, if they wish. No muslim would put a bullet in anybodies head for changing religion and if they do, then they are the enemies of Islam, not friends.

To clarify the enemies of Islam part, I meant... The person that trys to force someone into Islam or trys to use force to keep them in islam.

[EyeBrock]

Abbas Abbas:

$1:

A WOMAN, MAN or INBETWEEN can change, not obey or put down their religion, if they wish. No muslim would put a bullet in anybodies head for changing religion and if they do, then they are the enemies of Islam, not friends.

To clarify the enemies of Islam part, I meant... The person that trys to force someone into Islam or trys to use force to keep them in islam.

You didn't address my points where current Islam forces women to do things not written in any Sura's.

in response to your last post, plenty of examples in the media of converts to Christianity from Islam being persecuted. I wonder how many of these incidents have not been reported?

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/03/22/bush/index.html

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite? ... 2FShowFull

http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/a ... 013686.php

http://www.compassdirect.org/en/display ... ement=4596

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/artic ... E_ID=52410

There's a few to get on with.....

Moderate Islam? Is there such a thing?

[Banff]

Abbas Abbas:

Eye,

How would you knwo whos being opperessed by men and who isnt? I am sure you havnt left Canada in your life except prob went to the marti gra in the US once or twice.

I was trying to read the bible but couldnt decide which version would describe the best of the religion because they all seem to teach different things. Maybe you can point me in the right direction and show me the bible that hasnt been changed from the day of the Christ.

Women are deemed equal and I never said once, "WOMAN SHOULD BE COOKING, CLEANING", they should do whatever they desire, I was trying to point out that they are better at it then men. As, I have asked the question before, why is the nursing department flooded wiht women while trade jobs are 90% men and I know these facts because if you had taken a single sociology class, you would understand.

Saudi, has chruches and its Mecca where they dont allow any other religion to enter which is mostly for security reasons.

There is only one islam, yes it hasnt changed a bit since it was started but isnt that what a religion is all about. If man could change the religion as time goes on then how much of the religion is truth and how much is fake?

Eye, leave this conversation as you have never had any interractions with real Muslims, the day you are ready to join the Red Cross and go down to one of these countries yourself then you can argue with me all you want. (Yes, I have been to these muslim countries)

how much is Fake ? Sociology? If man could change the religion as time goes?
I don't know whether your religion believes anything regarding the woman being created by the mans rib , or the story of the garden of Eden where if the man kicks the woman out of the Garden another man will take the woman , or the flood , or any of Gods continuous changes throughout the first five books of the old testament , never mind the rest of it , or the new testament of the christian bible .

Changes are as common in any bible I have ever seen, including Gods words .You would most likely be familiar with God asking Abraham to bring his son to the mountain as a sacrifice and then telling him that he was just joking . (testing his faith in him) anyway if you do believe in creation I really don't think God equiped Eve with a burkha .

Covering up the body is one thing even for women , and dependant on the occasion , but only occasionally is the face and head necessary to cover . Blocking the mutual five senses all humans have from each other is rather obnoxious.

Knowing that woman are capable of functioning as well as men removing them from education is evil and removing them from something as simple as driving a car is defeating to both men and women . Concern over what a women is good at, forinstance maternal instinct is a given , and if they fail at that there is really no point trying to uncover or cover up how usless they may be at it .

New religions are only a cause created by an effect or like the bible or Koran to find a new design about life and to further enhance it , even Bureaucracy could be considered a religion Here is something maybe all of us could breifly ponder ... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burka

High rates of male unemployment and abandoned children are a factor , but unfortunately economics , banks , financial institutions , government etc have utilized women as an extra feature to raise prices , cost of mortgages collection of more taxes and stretched to such limits that it has become less of a benefit to the family than its original purpose leaving men and women choiclessly required to work and abandon their children to whoever will take them during the day and sometimes night .

[Abbas]

Well, Islam is here and it is moderate. The question you should be asking is, how you would have to change your way of thinking to co-exist with Muslims. If you plan on kicking out every muslim out of Canada then good luck.

I have not once questioned your faith because I am willing to except the good and the bad about it. If you are questioning Islam then you have gotten enough answers.

Its funny, how you tend to leave questions hanging when you cannot answer them.

Answers this: What if the US decided to invade Canada tommrow, what would you do? Would you expect muslims to stand down and let you fight your own battle or would you expect us to be part of this Canadian culture and pick up arms and fight along your side?

We are here and we are everywhere in the world, your extreme views about Islam will not help us or help you. It will only add fuel to the fire thats out of control as is.

EyeBrock EyeBrock:

Abbas Abbas:

$1:

A WOMAN, MAN or INBETWEEN can change, not obey or put down their religion, if they wish. No muslim would put a bullet in anybodies head for changing religion and if they do, then they are the enemies of Islam, not friends.

To clarify the enemies of Islam part, I meant... The person that trys to force someone into Islam or trys to use force to keep them in islam.

You didn't address my points where current Islam forces women to do things not written in any Sura's.

in response to your last post, plenty of examples in the media of converts to Christianity from Islam being persecuted. I wonder how many of these incidents have not been reported?

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/03/22/bush/index.html

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite? ... 2FShowFull

http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/a ... 013686.php

http://www.compassdirect.org/en/display ... ement=4596

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/artic ... E_ID=52410

There's a few to get on with.....

Moderate Islam? Is there such a thing?

[Abbas]

$1:

Covering up the body is one thing even for women , and dependant on the occasion , but only occasionally is the face and head necessary to cover . Blocking the mutual five senses all humans have from each other is rather obnoxious.

You people are the ones that are making the one statement over and over again. If a woman is equal and you truely believe that then let them cover their heads and let them cover their bodies without you trying to teach them how their religion should be.

When did a muslim ask a nun to take off her scarf because it covers all her 5 senses? When did we ask the Jewish people to take off their head covering?

If muslim women choose to follow their religion then they dont need another person telling them how it should be. I can list a million things about how christainity and jewdism should be but we all know thats not going to do anything but waste my time. So, lets follow our respective religions without telling other people how they should live their lives. So much for equality you people.

[Banff]

Abbas Abbas:

$1:

Covering up the body is one thing even for women , and dependant on the occasion , but only occasionally is the face and head necessary to cover . Blocking the mutual five senses all humans have from each other is rather obnoxious.

You people are the ones that are making the one statement over and over again. If a woman is equal and you truely believe that then let them cover their heads and let them cover their bodies without you trying to teach them how their religion should be.

When did a muslim ask a nun to take off her scarf because it covers all her 5 senses? When did we ask the Jewish people to take off their head covering?

If muslim women choose to follow their religion then they dont need another person telling them how it should be. I can list a million things about how christainity and jewdism should be but we all know thats not going to do anything but waste my time. So, lets follow our respective religions without telling other people how they should live their lives. So much for equality you people.

Telling people how to live ? Why don't they put a cardboard box over their head with a landscape painting over the front of it ? Is there a point to it religion or no religion ? Please tell us what is the point ?

[Abbas]

Banff Banff:

Abbas Abbas:

$1:

Covering up the body is one thing even for women , and dependant on the occasion , but only occasionally is the face and head necessary to cover . Blocking the mutual five senses all humans have from each other is rather obnoxious.

You people are the ones that are making the one statement over and over again. If a woman is equal and you truely believe that then let them cover their heads and let them cover their bodies without you trying to teach them how their religion should be.

When did a muslim ask a nun to take off her scarf because it covers all her 5 senses? When did we ask the Jewish people to take off their head covering?

If muslim women choose to follow their religion then they dont need another person telling them how it should be. I can list a million things about how christainity and jewdism should be but we all know thats not going to do anything but waste my time. So, lets follow our respective religions without telling other people how they should live their lives. So much for equality you people.

Telling people how to live ? Why don't they put a cardboard box over their head with a landscape painting over the front of it ? Is there a point to it religion or no religion ? Please tell us what is the point ?

There are several points to any religion. Living an honest life while practising self control would be a start.

I dont see nuns wearing cardboard boxes with landscape paintings over their heads, I mean is that how you view your own priests?

If you believe that your word is more important then Prophet Mohammeds then I will listen to every word you have to say once you have 1 billion people following you. Thnx

[camerontech]

Yo Abbas, just so you know Canada isin't composed of a bunch of Jews and Christians with some Muslims. It is an increasingly atheist country, so quit your comparisions to the jews and christians, you're not making your argument any stronger

[Regina]

I haven't seen a Nun in a habit or scarf since the sixties.

[EyeBrock]

Abbas Abbas:

Banff Banff:

Abbas Abbas:

$1:

Covering up the body is one thing even for women , and dependant on the occasion , but only occasionally is the face and head necessary to cover . Blocking the mutual five senses all humans have from each other is rather obnoxious.

You people are the ones that are making the one statement over and over again. If a woman is equal and you truely believe that then let them cover their heads and let them cover their bodies without you trying to teach them how their religion should be.

When did a muslim ask a nun to take off her scarf because it covers all her 5 senses? When did we ask the Jewish people to take off their head covering?

If muslim women choose to follow their religion then they dont need another person telling them how it should be. I can list a million things about how christainity and jewdism should be but we all know thats not going to do anything but waste my time. So, lets follow our respective religions without telling other people how they should live their lives. So much for equality you people.

Telling people how to live ? Why don't they put a cardboard box over their head with a landscape painting over the front of it ? Is there a point to it religion or no religion ? Please tell us what is the point ?

There are several points to any religion. Living an honest life while practising self control would be a start.

I dont see nuns wearing cardboard boxes with landscape paintings over their heads, I mean is that how you view your own priests?

If you believe that your word is more important then Prophet Mohammeds then I will listen to every word you have to say once you have 1 billion people following you. Thnx

Nuns don't wear niqabs or Burkhas. You can see their faces. They are holy women, not the average Christian in the street.

Besides Hollywood depictions I doubt you have ever spoken with a nun. I, on the other hand have visited several Mosques, spoke with Imams and got well aquainted with many Muslims.

I'm not advocating 'kicking' Muslims out, what I am against is the mediaval attitude that pervades Islam, even younger males like yourselves have positively archaic attitudes towards women.

These are not attributes that serve Canada well and you will find a good many freedom loving Canadians opposed to those 'values' that you import from the Third World.
Change your attitudes, as Christians have done over the past 2000 years and we will live in harmony.
Import your bigotry and you will be opposed.

[Banff]

There are only two thinks the burka could represent in the atheists world , christian world , or Islam world and that is shame or privacy . and concerning God it simply means that if you were to see his face you would surely die .Would we or you die if we seen the face of a muslim woman ? So I guess we all have to live with it even knowing eve was not equipped with a Burka . I guess we should all mind our own business when it comes down to whether a girl wants to dress Gothic , wear a burka , or let it all hang out .

I'm not trying to be rude but if you cannot see the lack of respect here especially when women are made lesser than their capabilities with it being illegal to drive amongst many other things the disrespect truly stands out about the burka (burqa) Maybe muslim men should not be allowed to cook and clean because they are as incapable of having enough knowledge to do so as women don't seem to have driving .

[Abbas]

Banff Banff:

There are only two thinks the burka could represent in the atheists world , christian world , or Islam world and that is shame or privacy . and concerning God it simply means that if you were to see his face you would surely die .Would we or you die if we seen the face of a muslim woman ? So I guess we all have to live with it even knowing eve was not equipped with a Burka . I guess we should all mind our own business when it comes down to whether a girl wants to dress Gothic , wear a burka , or let it all hang out .

I'm not trying to be rude but if you cannot see the lack of respect here especially when women are made lesser than their capabilities with it being illegal to drive amongst many other things the disrespect truly stands out about the burka (burqa) Maybe muslim men should not be allowed to cook and clean because they are as incapable of having enough knowledge to do so as women don't seem to have driving .

My mother owns a car, so do all my sisters. They all drive and I say good bye to them whenever I see them leaving. I dont see any burqas or anything on them instead of a simple cloth that covers their head referred to as DUBATA.

I dont want to argue whether women should wear it or not, you are telling me that the Prophet we follow is wrong then your arrogance is obvious.

If you see a woman with a burqa, I Am sure you are not going to die. EVE and ADAM can be equiped with whatever god wished but that doesnt concern me because I have GODS word in the Quran and whatever that says, I follow without asking questions.

If christainity changed over time then good for it. It wasnt muslims that asked you to change your ways, you decided that for youself. We decide to stick to every word that was said the first day Islam came into being, if thats a problem then once again, its your problem not mine. I will never admit that the word of Prophet Mohammed was anything but holy.

[Abbas]

I dont care what religion or culture dominates Canada. The reason I keep referresing to the Christains and Jews is because I know enough about them to talk about them. I am not going to make some retarded comment on a religion, I have no clue about like most of you guys.

camerontech camerontech:

Yo Abbas, just so you know Canada isin't composed of a bunch of Jews and Christians with some Muslims. It is an increasingly atheist country, so quit your comparisions to the jews and christians, you're not making your argument any stronger