[Regina]

Curtman Curtman:

People get locked up for using and selling drugs while murderers walk free.

Really? People who sell drugs don't walk free?

[OnTheIce]

Curtman Curtman:

I don't give even half a shit about my "right" to smoke or your right to drink. I care about stopping the violence and the destruction to families caused by the drug war, and waking people up to the fact that the drug war does no good, only harm.

Nobody believes that.

Nobody believes that a pot smoker is pushing forward for legalization to be a crime fighter.

To make matters worse, legalization won't stop crime or violence associated with drugs.

[Gunnair]

Curtman Curtman:

Gunnair Gunnair:

Comparing your desire to smoke pot in the same sentence as the civil rights movement.

I don't give even half a shit about my "right" to smoke or your right to drink. I care about stopping the violence and the destruction to families caused by the drug war, and waking people up to the fact that the drug war does no good, only harm.

I could go buy as much pot as I wanted right now, and smoke until I fall over. Nobody would stop me. Youve been arguing this for long enough that you must realize that this is a civil rights movement. We have the right to live in a just society and we don't. People get locked up for using and selling drugs while murderers walk free.

Sorry, but your cause is not as noble as you think it is.

[ShepherdsDog]

Yup...getting stoned is just a social crusade to end an injustice. That's it.

[Curtman]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Curtman Curtman:

I don't give even half a shit about my "right" to smoke or your right to drink. I care about stopping the violence and the destruction to families caused by the drug war, and waking people up to the fact that the drug war does no good, only harm.

Nobody believes that.

Nobody believes that a pot smoker is pushing forward for legalization to be a crime fighter.

To make matters worse, legalization won't stop crime or violence associated with drugs.

I support legalizing cocaine. Ive never used it. I support legal abortions, there's no chance I'll ever have one. You are wrong about this.

[PublicAnimalNo9]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Curtman Curtman:

I don't give even half a shit about my "right" to smoke or your right to drink. I care about stopping the violence and the destruction to families caused by the drug war, and waking people up to the fact that the drug war does no good, only harm.

Nobody believes that.

Nobody believes that a pot smoker is pushing forward for legalization to be a crime fighter.

To make matters worse, legalization won't stop crime or violence associated with drugs.

Oh for... Ya know what OTI? Yer right. Since legalization won't remove 100% of the criminals from the market, let's just let the criminals HAVE 100% of the market. Yep, it's an all or nothing scenario for you isn't it. Since we can't eliminate 100% of the criminal aspect, there's no point in even trying.
Well, seeing how criminals have their hands in the alcohol distribution industry, let's just make alcohol illegal too, since being legal has not stopped the crime or violence associated with it.

Hell, let's make everything illegal that organized crime has its hands in; strip bars, all guns, tobacco, casinos, off-track betting parlours, unions, the construction industry, various police services, politics, etc etc.

[andyt]

The problem is that if we legalize but the US doesn't, the impact on crime will be quite small, because as a cop at that meeting pointed out, that's where most of the pot we grow goes. So you'll still have all the gang activity until the US follows suit. But, somebody gotta make the first step, nothing wrong with it being us. And it will prevent 58,000 Canadians being arrested for possession a year, give the cops and the courts something better to do with their time.

[Gunnair]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Curtman Curtman:

I don't give even half a shit about my "right" to smoke or your right to drink. I care about stopping the violence and the destruction to families caused by the drug war, and waking people up to the fact that the drug war does no good, only harm.

Nobody believes that.

Nobody believes that a pot smoker is pushing forward for legalization to be a crime fighter.

To make matters worse, legalization won't stop crime or violence associated with drugs.

Oh for... Ya know what OTI? Yer right. Since legalization won't remove 100% of the criminals from the market, let's just let the criminals HAVE 100% of the market. Yep, it's an all or nothing scenario for you isn't it. Since we can't eliminate 100% of the criminal aspect, there's no point in even trying.
Well, seeing how criminals have their hands in the alcohol distribution industry, let's just make alcohol illegal too, since being legal has not stopped the crime or violence associated with it.

Hell, let's make everything illegal that organized crime has its hands in; strip bars, all guns, tobacco, casinos, off-track betting parlours, unions, the construction industry, various police services, politics, etc etc.

You're right I course. As one who would like to see decriminalization I agree that it will have an affect on the criminal element. What gets my ire up and Curt is often guilty of this is when decriminalization is put out as a panacea against gang activity and that not supporting decriminalization somehow makes you guilty of increasing gang activity. Yes it will reduce that activity......for a while until something new shows up. I submit that I doubt it will have the significant affext

[Gunnair]

PublicAnimalNo9 PublicAnimalNo9:

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Curtman Curtman:

I don't give even half a shit about my "right" to smoke or your right to drink. I care about stopping the violence and the destruction to families caused by the drug war, and waking people up to the fact that the drug war does no good, only harm.

Nobody believes that.

Nobody believes that a pot smoker is pushing forward for legalization to be a crime fighter.

To make matters worse, legalization won't stop crime or violence associated with drugs.

Oh for... Ya know what OTI? Yer right. Since legalization won't remove 100% of the criminals from the market, let's just let the criminals HAVE 100% of the market. Yep, it's an all or nothing scenario for you isn't it. Since we can't eliminate 100% of the criminal aspect, there's no point in even trying.
Well, seeing how criminals have their hands in the alcohol distribution industry, let's just make alcohol illegal too, since being legal has not stopped the crime or violence associated with it.

Hell, let's make everything illegal that organized crime has its hands in; strip bars, all guns, tobacco, casinos, off-track betting parlours, unions, the construction industry, various police services, politics, etc etc.

You're right I course. As one who would like to see decriminalization I agree that it will have an affect on the criminal element. What gets my ire up and Curt is often guilty of this is when decriminalization is put out as a panacea against gang activity and that not supporting decriminalization somehow makes you guilty of increasing gang activity. Yes it will reduce that activity......for a while until something new shows up. I submit that I doubt it will have the significant affect often ascribed to it because it will still be sold illegally (just like cigarettes) and much easier since it is not such a process to refine. Gangs will undercut taxed pot and sell it illegally....just as they do now.

[Lemmy]

OnTheIce OnTheIce:

Curtman Curtman:

I don't give even half a shit about my "right" to smoke or your right to drink. I care about stopping the violence and the destruction to families caused by the drug war, and waking people up to the fact that the drug war does no good, only harm.

Nobody believes that.

Nobody believes that a pot smoker is pushing forward for legalization to be a crime fighter.

To make matters worse, legalization won't stop crime or violence associated with drugs.

It won't STOP it, but it's reasonable to presume that legalization will reduce drug crime by a similar degree that reversing prohibition in the 1920s reduced alcohol-related crime. Are you suggesting that legalizing alcohol didn't reduce the crime associated with the illegal liquor trade?

[andyt]

Gunnair Gunnair:

Gangs will undercut taxed pot and sell it illegally....just as they do now.

Certainly cut into their profit margin compared to what they sell it for now. Probably come the day when it's legal on both sides of the border, but taxed more heavily here, and gangs are smuggling pot into Canada. Still, they'll have to compete with a legal product sold above board at convenient outlets. Besides price, that will also get many people buying the legit stuff. Under age would probably be their biggest market, but under age already has easy access to pot. All bets are off tho if the govt repeats the idiocity of giving a special deal to the Indigenous Peoples as they did with cigs.

[Lemmy]

andyt andyt:

Gunnair Gunnair:

Gangs will undercut taxed pot and sell it illegally....just as they do now.

Certainly cut into their profit margin compared to what they sell it for now. Probably come the day when it's legal on both sides of the border, but taxed more heavily here, and gangs are smuggling pot into Canada. Still, they'll have to compete with a legal product sold above board at convenient outlets. Besides price, that will also get many people buying the legit stuff. Under age would probably be their biggest market, but under age already has easy access to pot. All bets are off tho if the govt repeats the idiocity of giving a special deal to the Indigenous Peoples as they did with cigs.

Which is why pot should be legalized and the government kept out of the trade. If it were treated like any other plant that people are allowed to grow and harvest, like tomatoes or green peppers, there'd be no opportunity for gang activity. Or have Hell's Angels diversified into the tomato business?

[andyt]

Radical, dude. Do you say the same for tobacco and booze?

[Lemmy]

andyt andyt:

Radical, dude. Do you say the same for tobacco and booze?

Absolutely. It's already happening to a degree. Lots of people make their own wine and beer. Making your own liquor should absolutely be allowed. The difference is that making whisky is a much more labour and skill intensive process than growing pot. So pot better lends itself to home-production.

[andyt]

I think any rational legalization of pot would allow for small scale home production. I don't know about growing greenhouses full of it the way tomatoes and peppers are grown tho. I like the idea of sin taxes because it makes the users pay for the costs associated with their drug of choice.