[Guy_Fawkes]

Gunnair Gunnair:

So... you'd say they're more like landmines then? Which are still used by several countries... legally.

Yes, some are similar but landmines are much safer to handle and are much less likely to kill a non combatant than a IED of the same configuration.

Suicide Vests and Vehicle IEDs are much closer to a missle.

[Gunnair]

Guy_Fawkes Guy_Fawkes:

Gunnair Gunnair:

So... you'd say they're more like landmines then? Which are still used by several countries... legally.

Yes, some are similar but landmines are much safer to handle and are much less likely to kill a non combatant than a IED of the same configuration.

Suicide Vests and Vehicle IEDs are much closer to a missle.

I think if you do a little wiki search on how many non combatants are being killed and maimed every year around the world I'd submit that your first statement is wrong. I agree with second.

[Thanos]

Going by the comments I've seen on the rest of the internet it's other Marines, both current and former-serving, and other military personnel who seem most pissed off at this incident. It's really only the dickhead "I would have shit on the corpses too" Muslim-hater chickenhawks in the rightwing blogosphere that are being their usual douchey selves about this. The real soldiers that've been over there apparently think that this is as big a black eye to the Corps as was that asshole a few years back who threw that puppy off of a cliff in Iraq.

[andyt]

Thanos Thanos:

Going by the comments I've seen on the rest of the internet it's other Marines, both current and former-serving, and other military personnel who seem most pissed off at this incident. It's really only the dickhead "I would have shit on the corpses too" Muslim-hater chickenhawks in the rightwing blogosphere that are being their usual douchey selves about this. The real soldiers that've been over there apparently think that this is as big a black eye to the Corps as was that asshole a few years back who threw that puppy off of a cliff in Iraq.

It's only a black eye if the Corps doesn't do anything about it. Otherwise it's "a few bad apples." But worse yet, IMO, is the extra danger they've put their fellow soldiers in, and harming the mission, whatever that is.

[Guy_Fawkes]

Gunnair Gunnair:

Guy_Fawkes Guy_Fawkes:

Gunnair Gunnair:

So... you'd say they're more like landmines then? Which are still used by several countries... legally.

Yes, some are similar but landmines are much safer to handle and are much less likely to kill a non combatant than a IED of the same configuration.

Suicide Vests and Vehicle IEDs are much closer to a missle.

I think if you do a little wiki search on how many non combatants are being killed and maimed every year around the world I'd submit that your first statement is wrong. I agree with second.

I just want to make sure you want me to go on Wiki to teach myself which is more dangerous....

A mine like a PROM-1 set up for pressure or a pressure cooker full of ANFO set to go off when a person contacts two saw blades together wrapped in bicycle tubing?

Which do you think is more dangerous?

You might want to check your answer with SprCforr.

[Gunnair]

Guy_Fawkes Guy_Fawkes:

Gunnair Gunnair:

Guy_Fawkes Guy_Fawkes:

Yes, some are similar but landmines are much safer to handle and are much less likely to kill a non combatant than a IED of the same configuration.

Suicide Vests and Vehicle IEDs are much closer to a missle.

I think if you do a little wiki search on how many non combatants are being killed and maimed every year around the world I'd submit that your first statement is wrong. I agree with second.

I just want to make sure you want me to go on Wiki to teach myself which is more dangerous....

A mine like a PROM-1 set up for pressure or a pressure cooker full of ANFO set to go off when a person contacts two saw blades together wrapped in bicycle tubing?

Which do you think is more dangerous?

You might want to check your answer with SprCforr.

My bad. All those people that are being killed and maimed by land mines each year are in fact not being killed and maimed by land mines?

I will recheck and find out what did it to them then.

Quick look

1999 - 2008: 73,576 land mine casualties - not unsafe IEDs but the safer land mines.

Point here, Guy, is not the ridiculously insignificant difference in safety but that the line between evil IEDs and legal land mines is a C hair in width. I thought you might have cottoned on to that.

My bad again.

[Guy_Fawkes]

I'll say it again, landmines and IEDs are both dangerous and are both killers.

The reason landmines have a higher kill count is because they have been employed since the early 40s in large numbers. Some armies do not even keep record of where they lay their mines. IEDs (improvised landmines) have only been used in large amounts in recent history.

This difference in safety is not so ridiculous to the people who have to render them safe.

[peck420]

Guy,

The first land mines were nothing more than IED's.

[Guy_Fawkes]

peck420 peck420:

Guy,

The first land mines were nothing more than IED's.

Oh really Peck, where did you learn this?

[Gunnair]

Guy_Fawkes Guy_Fawkes:

I'll say it again, landmines and IEDs are both dangerous and are both killers.

The reason landmines have a higher kill count is because they have been employed since the early 40s in large numbers. Some armies do not even keep record of where they lay their mines. IEDs (improvised landmines) have only been used in large amounts in recent history.

This difference in safety is not so ridiculous to the people who have to render them safe.

Guy, I'm not sure why you think safety is a noteworthy point here so I'll resubmit. My point with IEDs and land mines was of a moral nature not a safety one.

Hope that's clearer.

[Guy_Fawkes]

Gunnair Gunnair:

Guy_Fawkes Guy_Fawkes:

I'll say it again, landmines and IEDs are both dangerous and are both killers.

The reason landmines have a higher kill count is because they have been employed since the early 40s in large numbers. Some armies do not even keep record of where they lay their mines. IEDs (improvised landmines) have only been used in large amounts in recent history.

This difference in safety is not so ridiculous to the people who have to render them safe.

Guy, I'm not sure why you think safety is a noteworthy point here so I'll resubmit. My point with IEDs and land mines was of a moral nature not a safety one.

Hope that's clearer.

I understand, I know saying this will make me sound like a broken record and a maybe a bit of a dick but, I think that the safety of a weapon impacts how moral it is.

While both weapon systems can in indiscriminately kill (depending on how you deploy them), IEDs can be unpredictable.

You take a M16 APERS mine, bury it and come back in a month the mine will be in almost the exact same condition and can be rendered safe with little difficulty. Bury an IED for a month and come back you have no idea what condition it will be in, it could be more sensitive or could be less. Hell the thing might even blow up without anyone touching it.

With all of this aside the Taliban believe they are fighting to preserve their way of life, if Canada was invaded by an opposing force you are fool to think that after our conventional munitions were used up we wouldnt resort to improvised weapons.

While the morality of a weapon can be determined, ultimately it is the morality of the person that uses it which counts.

[peck420]

Guy_Fawkes Guy_Fawkes:

peck420 peck420:

Guy,

The first land mines were nothing more than IED's.

Oh really Peck, where did you learn this?

History.

Chinese made IED's out of rockets circa 13th century. Progressed to mines of different types for different situations by the 14th century.

Surprisingly similar to how many IED's are made today, but birthed the land mine none the less.

[desertdude]

Thanos Thanos:

It's really only the dickhead "I would have shit on the corpses too" Muslim-hater chickenhawks in the rightwing blogosphere that are being their usual douchey selves about this.

i.e : Bart and his ilk.

$1:

The real soldiers that've been over there apparently think that this is as big a black eye to the Corps as was that asshole a few years back who threw that puppy off of a cliff in Iraq.

Yes I would like to believe and hope so too, key word here being "real soilders"

[BartSimpson]

desertdude desertdude:

Thanos Thanos:

It's really only the dickhead "I would have shit on the corpses too" Muslim-hater chickenhawks in the rightwing blogosphere that are being their usual douchey selves about this.

i.e : Bart and his ilk.

I didn't say I'd do anything to the corpses. I just said that I'm quite indifferent to the fact that someone else did.

25 years ago I would have been shocked and outraged by such a thing but after seeing too many atrocities up close and personal that have been visited upon Americans by the good people in your 'neighborhood' I really and truly do not give a flying f*ck if someone pees on a dead Taliban.

[RUEZ]

Guy_Fawkes Guy_Fawkes:

if Canada was invaded by an opposing force you are fool to think that after our conventional munitions were used up we wouldnt resort to improvised weapons.

If Canada allowed training camps that were used to train and prepare for the murder of 3000 people I'd probably be fighting against whatever government allowed that.